Summary
Faye Black (President and Chief Executive Officer, Regional Airlines Association (RAA)) said 193 airports have fewer flights than pre-pandemic, with 14 losing all scheduled service.
Gregory Pecoraro (President and Chief Executive Officer, National Association of State Aviation Officials (NASAO)) urged Congress to direct DOT and FAA to create a national small-community air service strategy.
Rep. Larsen (D, WA-2) pressed Black on fuel price shocks, and Black said small-aircraft economics make thin rural routes unprofitable very quickly.
Rep. Larsen (D, WA-2) blamed rising jet-fuel costs on Iran actions, while Rep. McDowell (R, NC-6) focused on pilot shortages and EAS reform costs.
Shawn Dobberstein (Executive Director, Fargo Airport Authority) warned IIJA airport funding ends after fiscal 2026, urging stable AIP and ATC modernization to avoid a funding cliff.
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Hearing details
View on Congress.govHouse of Representatives
Aviation Subcommittee
2h 26m
Witnesses4
President and Chief Executive Officer, Regional Airlines Association (RAA)
Executive Director, Fargo Airport Authority
Director, Physical Infrastructure, United States Government Accountability Office
President and Chief Executive Officer, National Association of State Aviation Officials (NASAO)
Members who spoke21
Transcript
I call the Committee on Transportation Infrastructure to order. Pursuant to Committee Rule six F and House Rule eleven clause two HF, the Chairman may postpone further proceedings today on any question of approving any measure in matter of adopting an amendment in which the recorded vote of the yeas and nays is ordered. I'd ask unanimous consent that the Chairman be authorized to declare a recess at any time during today's meeting and without objection that is so ordered. All rosters and texts have been distributed electronically and paper copies are also available here in the hearing room. As a reminder, the committee may use an electronic voting system for any requested recorded votes. So today the committee is considering approval of updated subcommittee rosters due to changes on the majority side, the fiscal year twenty twenty seven views and estimates of the committee on transportation and infrastructure, and a general services administration capital investment and leasing program resolution. And finally, unanimous consent for the committee to use an amendments roster for any items under consideration by the committee. And without objection that's so ordered. Our first item for business today is approval of the revised subcommittee roster due to uh membership changes on the majority side. And so I call up the subcommittee rosters for consideration. Without objection the rosters will be considered as read and recognized. I recognize myself uh for a quick statement. Pursuant to House Resolution eleven seventy-six, Congressman Clay Fuller of Georgia and Congressman Kevin Kiley of California were appointed to the Committee on Transportation and Infrastructure. I'm pleased to welcome the newest member of the House of Representatives, Congressman Clay Fuller from Northwest Georgia to the committee. Prior to his election, Congressman Fuller served as an officer in the United States Air Force and Georgia Air National Guard and he also served as a District Attorney for Lookout Mountain Judicial Circuit. He's already had an eventful introduction to the committee as he participated in our surface mark-up just a couple weeks ago. Revised rosters reflect the addition of Congressman Fuller to the subcommittee on Water Resources and Environment Highways and Transit, and Railroads, Pipelines, and Hazardous Materials. Congressman Kiley to the subcommittees on Water Resources and Environment, Highways and Transit, and Economic Development, Public Buildings, and Emergency Management. Congressman Kiley, we are glad uh to have you back on the committee and Congressman Fuller, we look forward to working with you for the rest of uh for the rest of the Congress. Is there anyone else wish to speak on the amendments roster? Seeing none, I'd ask you now on this consent for the approval of revised subcommittee rosters due to membership changes uh on the majority side and without objection that is so ordered the revised subcommittee rosters have been approved. The next item for consideration is the views and estimates of the Committee on Transportation Infrastructure fiscal year twenty twenty seven. And I call up the views and estimates and without objection the first reading is dispensed with. The views and estimates are now considered as read and open for amendment at any point. Recognize myself for a quick statement. The committee has been busy and productive. During the hundred and nineteen Congress, we've held forty-nine hearings and round tables, reported fifty-three bills out of committee and forty-six bills referred to the committee have been approved by the House. Most recently, the committee favorably reported the Build Act two fifty or the Build America two fifty Act a bipartisan surface transportation reauthorization which provides core infrastructure investments to the nation. This bill will advance our highways and railroads and contains the largest investment in bridges in the history of the United States. This critical bill also addresses the highway trust fund fairness issue, strengthens the user fee foundation that it was built upon and provides new funding for the trust funds the first time in over thirty years. I can't stress how important uh it was for the commu- uh that the committee acted to ensure that all users of the nation's uh highways begin paying into the highway trust fund, not just the users who drive gas and diesel powered vehicles. and it provided this new funding mechanism to the Highway Trust Fund. Further, the committee helped deliver reconciliation legislation that provided historic investments to the United States Coast Guard for border and national security, as well as a down payment on the modernization of America's air traffic control system. And it will continue to be busy uh this Congress uh for the committee as we work together on a Water Resources Development Act, advance the committee's reported pipeline safety bill, female reform in aviation safety legislation and more. And I'm proud to say that we've advanced critical legislation in a bipartisan manner and our hard work is paying off for the American people. I appreciate ranking member uh Larson for working with us on all these important um items as well as abusing estimates um that we are considering today and I'd urge my colleagues to support the abusing estimates for fiscal year twenty twenty-seven and now rep recognize Rick.
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you for working collaboratively on the We've had a productive session so far, having drafted and passed the bipartisan Alert Act in the House and marking up a bipartisan surface transportation reauthorization bill in this committee. We still have work to do for the remainder of Congress, including working with the Senate to get the Alert Act enacted, getting the Build Act uh, Build America to fifty Act and the FEMA Act to the floor and enacted, and passing a bipartisan Water Resources Development Act or word-out bill. as well as conducting our continued oversight of the administration's air traffic control modernization efforts. These views and estimates, I believe, reflect our desire to continue working in a bipartisan and productive manner, and I urge my colleagues to join me in supporting the FY twenty twenty-seven budget views and estimates. With that, I yield back.
Do any other members wish to be recognized? Seeing no one. Are there any amendments to the views and estimates for fiscal year twenty twenty seven? Hearing none, the question is now on adopting and submitting the views and estimates for fiscal year twenty twenty seven to the house committee on budget. All those in favor, signify by saying aye.
Aye.
All opposed, signify by saying nay. The ayes have it, and the views and estimates for fiscal year twenty s twenty seven are adopted. Pursuant to house rule ten clause four, I'd ask unanimous consent. fiscal year twenty twenty seven views and estimates as adopted by the committee on transportation and infrastructure be submitted to the committee on budget without objection that is so ordered our last item for consideration is a resolution for a project in the general services administration's capital investment and leasing program and i'd ask unanimous consent to call up the resolution it is now considered as read and open for amendment at any point without objection That is so ordered. Recognize myself quickly for a statement. So the GSA resolution that we're considering today is an alter or or alteration project of the GSA's headquarters. Uh, this prospectus will allow GSA and OPM to consolidate into one building. This continues the committee's efforts to shrink the federal footprint, reducing the taxpayers' liability, and ensure that space usage is cons uh consistent. with requirements set in the public buildings reforms that we enacted in the Water Resource and Development Act of twenty twenty four. In fact, GSA has informed the committee that this would boost the building utilization uh r uh rate by over eighty percent. I wanna thank subcommittee chairman Perry for his work on ensuring that this project makes sense uh to the taxpayers. With that, I urge my committee to support the resolution and recognize Rickford's statement.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I support the GSA's resolution before us today, which provides the um um GSA with the authority to renovate its headquarters building located at eighteen hundred F street northwest in the c in the capital. Eighteen hundred F street was constructed for the Department of Interior in nineteen seventeen and placed on the National Register of Historic Places in nineteen eighty six. Between two thousand nine and two thousand thirteen, GSA used American recovery and reinvestment. Act funding to renovate elevator, mechanical, plumbing, and life sa- safety systems in sixty percent of the building. But the remaining forty percent of the building has been emptied due to poor ventilation. In twenty twenty six, FYI twenty twenty six, that is, GSA submitted the prospectus before us today, which provide GSA with two hundred and thirty-nine million dollars to complete the renovations. GSA plans to keep this building in its inventory and and co-locate the Office of Personnel Management there. According to GSA, once GSA and OPM are in the building, the utilization rate will exceed eighty percent. So I support this resolution and urge my colleagues to do the same, and with that yield back.
Does anyone else wish to be recognized on the GSA resolution? Seeing no further. Speakers, are there any amendments to the GSA resolution? Hearing none, the question is now on the adoption of the GSA resolution. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. All opposed, signify by saying nay. If any of the chair, the ayes have it. And the GSA resolution is agreed to and approved. Thank you everyone for participating today. Pursuant to committee rule six of the rules of the Committee on Transportation Infrastructure, I'd note the presence of a quorum for actions taken on all committee business today. I'd ask unanimous consent that the staff be authorized to make all necessary technical, clarifying and conforming changes to each item adopted today to reflect the actions of the committee. Without objection, that is so ordered. I'll remind members that we're about to transition into an aviation subcommittee hearing please allow staff just a moment to prepare the hearing room for the next, uh, committee activity. And with that, the Committee on Transportation and Infrastructure has completed its administrative and organizational business. For the day, the committee stands adjourned.
The subcommittee on aviation will come to order. I ask you and ask consent that the chairman be authorized to declare recess at any time during today's hearing. Without objection so ordered, I also ask you and ask sent it to members on, not on the subcommittee, be permitted to sit with the subcommittee at today's hearing and ask questions. Without objection so ordered, and as a reminder, if members wish to insert a document into the record, please email it to documents TI at mail dot house dot gov. I now recognize myself for the purpose of an opening statement. Good morning and thank you to our panel of witnesses for being here today. Good to see you. Each of you brings a unique perspective to this important discussion on the state of America's small airports and rural communities' access to the national airspace or the NAS. Airports are more than transportation hubs. They are economic engines supporting Americans' livelihoods, connecting communities, and enhancing quality of life. There are nearly five thousand public use airports and helipads, heliports across the United States, and almost thirty-three hundred of these facilities are on the FAA's national plan of integrated airport systems. These numbers are certain to grow as advanced air mobility technologies emerge and become integrated into the aviation system. Yet, all of these facilities, only sixty-four are large or medium hub airports. Understandably, they get a lot of attention. But there are another four hundred and fifty airports providing critical commercial passenger service across the country. While they are well known within their communities, the air these airports deserve greater attention and stronger support from Congress. For the forty-six million Americans living in rural communities, these facilities provide the same critical access to the NAS as larger airports do for urban Americans. All of you are here today to help us better highlight the value of these facilities, the role they play in their communities, and the challenges they face in maintaining and expanding access. According to a recent study by the Airports Council International North America, commercial airports in the United States support over twelve point eight million jobs, six hundred and eighteen billion in wages, and one point eight trillion with a T in economic output. Notably, every additional one thousand in plain in payments generate nearly seven hundred thousand in economic output and supports six additional jobs. We should be working together to increase employments at these airports, so all Americans can share these economic benefits. Fortunately, there are strong federal programs designed to support communities, maintaining existing service, expanding service, and attracting new carriers, ultimately increasing employments. Essential Air Service is the most well-known of these programs. In the FAA Reauthorization Act of twenty twenty four, Congress strengthened and reformed EAS, to improve accountability, restore fiscal discipline, and better target limited resources to the communities most in need. The Small Community Air Service Development Program also grant also gives communities the opportunity to identify their own air service needs, recruit carriers, offer revenue guarantees, conduct studies, and market new service. Importantly, this program encourages local business investment, the skin in the game approach incentivize services that are more likely to succeed long term without subsidies. Lastly, the Airport Improvement Program, or AIP, distributes resources generated by user fees and fuel taxes by formula to all new public use airports in the NPIAS. I would be remiss not to recognize the significant progress the Trump administration has made in modernizing uh the air track control system. Under secretary Duffer and administrator Bedford's leadership, more than two thousand air traffic controllers, they were hired last year. More than twelve thousand applied to become controllers this year. Six hundred and twelve new radar systems are being deployed. Half of the outdated copper wiring has already been replaced with modern fiber optics. Seventeen control towers transitioned from paper flight strips to electronic systems, and fifty-four airports now have surface awareness systems. Clearly, the future of American aviation is bright. And with that, I again thank our witnesses for traveling here today, and I look forward to your testimony. I will now recognize Ranking Member Carson for five minute opening statement.
Good morning. Thank you, Chairman Nils, uh Chairman Graves, and Ranking Member Larson. Uh it is an honor to be here for our first aviation subcommittee hearing this year. Welcome to our witnesses again for joining today's hearing on trends, opportunities and challenges facing small communities and rural commercial service airports. Air service for small and rural communities is important to many members of this committee. While Indianapolis International Airport is one of the busiest in the country, there are four airports in Indiana that have essential air service, determinations for routes that connect through Chicago O'Hare Airport. The twenty twenty four FAA reauthorization is actively creating a positive economic impact on small and rural communities through the preservation of EAS programs and raising the per-passenger subsidy caps, improving the alternative EAS program, increasing the small community air service development program, annual authorization level from ten million dollars to fifteen million dollars, and while prioritizing applications that restore flights that have been lost or substantially reduced, and boosting airport improvement programs, uh funding to four billion dollars per year and revising apportionment which increased annual formula funds for both large and small airports. Uh, finally, we can all agree that airline passengers, regardless of whether they're flying into a major hub or a non-hub airport in their small communities deserve one level of safety. This means maintaining and improving the similar pilot training requirements, aircraft certification standards, air traffic control staffing, and technology. safety data tracking, and other tools that we use to keep the national airspace system safe. Thank you again to our witnesses. You all play a very critical role in ensuring continued service to small and rural communities in our yield back.
The gentlemen yields I now recognize the Chairman of the full committee, Mister Graves, for five.
Thank you, Chairman Niles, and I want to thank our witnesses for uh uh for all being here. Last year Congress passed and the President has signed into law an historic, twelve and a half billion dollar in our nation's aviation infrastructure, uh accomplishment that uh I was very proud to have led in the uh uh in the House. That investment is already delivering meaningful results, as has been dem or pointed out today already. Deploying new radars, replacing communications infrastructure, uh deploying airport surveillance systems, and hiring record number uh of air traffic controllers. There's more to be done and additional investments are needed to complete this modernization and I'm committed to working with the administration and my colleagues to identify the remaining needs and find a vehicle to secure those resources that uh are gonna be needed to finish the job. We must continue to build upon the momentum initiated by last year's historic investment and expeditiously roll out the most modern and safest aviation system possible. Whether they support commercial, passenger service or provide public accessibility facilities for general aviation pilots, Airports are pillars of our community and drive economic uh growth and improve the quality of life of all of our communities. Critically small airports are also the primary training ground for pilots. We must protect and preserve our freedom to fly for everyone, whether they are operating a personal aircraft or conducting uh business aviation or traveling as passengers on commercial airlines. That's why I'm proud that this committee worked in a very bipartisan uh fashion to pass the FAA reauthorization act of twenty twenty four and we continue to construct conduct strong oversight uh of its uh implementation. This bipartisan law made important reforms to the aviation sector by addressing workforce challenges improving passenger experience establishing the first ever general aviation title and increasing financial supports for airports nationwide and with that, Mister uh Chairman, I yield back.
gentlemen yields. I now recognize the ranking member of the full committee, Mister Larson.
Thank you, Chair Nels and Ranking Member Carson, for holding today's hearing on connecting rural America to the national aerospace system. I thank the witnesses for joining us today, and we have plenty to discuss. I look forward to your testimony. Airports are vital economic engines that power our local communities, especially in small and rural ones, and many of the ones I represent. They serve as critical transportation hubs to safely bring people together.
Yes, sir.
This will be important in the coming weeks as fans travel across the country and from around the world to watch their favorite teams in the World Cup.
True.
And we look forward to welcoming them to the Pacific Northwest, where Seattle and Vancouver will be hosting thirteen of those games. Airports also generate good jobs, simulate local businesses, and attract financial investment. A twenty twenty five Airports Council International North America study found that airports with commercial service support twelve point eight million jobs and produce one point eight trillion dollars of annual output. In my district we have a few small airports. Reigning from Arlington Municipal Airport, my hometown, which dates to nineteen thirty four, uh, Orcas Island Airport, Lopez Airport, Friday Harbor Airport, Skagit County Regional Airport, uh, I don't wanna forget, concrete airport, um, there's a few more as well. They're all gonna call me and tell me I forgot to name them. But Congress recognized the importance of small and rural airports when we passed the twenty twenty-four FAA reauthorization. The law increases funding for airport the airport improvement program to four billion dollars annually of a we of a of which at least one hundred and fifty million must be spent on airport climate noise or other environmental projects. The law also provides uh improves the lives of neighboring airport communities by requiring the FAA to develop a plan to transition away from leaded fuel in general aviation by twenty thirty. So whether connected via regional airlines, uh charter flights, or general aviation, these small and rural hubs serve as alternatives to overburden most metropolitan airports. Unfortunately, regional and value airlines sp uh face specific challenges ranging from workforce uh issues to surging fuel prices. Many of you mentioned in your testimony uh the increased demands on the NASS have inc also increased demand for skilled aviation workforce. Mister Collins, you specifically mentioned the need for more aviation maintenance technicians while other witnesses referenced the increased competition for pilots. To meet these needs without decreasing our safety standards, Congress, the FAA, and stakeholders must expand the talent pipeline and improve efforts to recruit, train, and retain a robust U. S. aerospace uh workforce from every part of our society. To address this, the twenty twenty-four reauthorization invests sixty million dollars annually in aviation workforce development grants to train the next generation of aviation manufacturing workers, airport maintenance technicians, and pilots. in the Northwest and across this country, aviation means jobs that pay well and are key to long-term economic growth, and I encourage the FAA to quickly implement these programs and distribute these grants in a timely manner. Ms. Black, your testimony also touches upon small aircraft economics and how increased operation costs have led regional carriers to use larger, more efficient planes. Mr. Collins and Mr. Pecoraro, you both explained that a factor contributing to this trend is the lack of regional jet manufacturing pipelines, just as there aren't many options for new fuel-efficient regional jets. It's a challenge that uh the Pacific Northwest is up to tackling. To help meet these regional aircraft needs, the twenty twenty-four bill directed the FAA to bring on a much needed expertise in its aircraft certification office. We have to maintain the certification office's institutional knowledge to meet the requirements of the aircraft certification reform law and grow the agency's technical expertise to better assess new designs. In this way, when new regional aircraft are designed and proposed, staff at the FAA are there to support that innovation. Finally, we can't talk about the small and rural connectivity uh of airports without discussing how the president's actions in Iran have spiked fuel prices, specifically jet fuel. In general, fuel expenses account for a larger share of air carrier budgets than most other industries making them particularly vulnerable to price fluctuations. Exacerbating this issue, smaller regional and value air carriers have fewer resources than their larger counterpart parts to absorb these rising operational costs. Consequently, the drastic increase in jet fuel prices places a unique burden, financial burden, on regional and value airlines, often forcing these carriers to reduce flight frequencies, further eliminate routes, or increase ticket prices. This directly impacts small and rural communities through rising travel costs or loss of service altogether. We can't allow this to happen. The president needs to resolve this fuel price crisis of his own making. As this committee considers the future of rural aviation and small community connectivity, we have to continue investing in the airports, in workforce, and in the innovation that keeps our communities connected to the NAS. We can't ignore the economic pressures facing regional carriers, including rising fuel costs that threaten service to the very communities that depend upon it most. So I look forward to uh to the hearing today. uh in hearing from today's witnesses on how we can help strengthen rural connectivity, uphold our safety standards, and support American in aviation and innovation. Thank you.
The gentlemen yield. Briefly take a moment to explain our lighting. You guys have been here before. We just keep your remarks to five minutes, okay? Uh, I ask you in ask consent that the witnesses' full statements be included in the record without objection so ordered. I also ask you in ask consent that the record of today's hearing remain open until such time as our witnesses have provided answers to any questions that may be submitted to them in writing, without objection so ordered. I also ask you now to the extent that the record remain open for fifteen days for any additional comments and information submitted by members or witnesses to be included in the record of today's hearing without objection so ordered. And as your written testimony has been made part of the record, the subcommittee asks that you limit your oral marks again five minutes. With that, Miss Black, you're recognized.
Thank you, Chairman, Ranking Member, members of the subcommittee. Thanks for holding this hearing today, and thanks for the opportunity to be here. Last year, Regional Airlines flew one in three departure, and served almost all US airports. We fly to communities of all sizes, but for two thirds of the nation's airports, we provide the only source of scheduled commercial air service. That service connects people to health care, colleges, military bases, and loved ones. It supports a hundred and fifty-three billion dollars in yearly economic But rural America still doesn't have the air service that it needs. A pilot shortage that predated the pandemic worsened after it, forcing regional airlines to park about a quarter of the fleet, and pushing small community air service into crisis. Today, overall service is up, but passengers don't experience air service in the aggregate. They experience whether their local airport still has the schedules and destinations that meet their needs. Today, a hundred and ninety-three airports have fewer flights than before the pandemic, and the average loss at those airports is thirty-one percent of their flights. Thirty-five have lost more than half their flights, fourteen airports have gone dark completely, and smaller smaller airports are faring the worst. Several forces are driving this. First, infrastructure. Safety is the foundation of everything we do, and air traffic control modernization is foundational to safety. I'm a member of the Modern Skies coalition and I support its goals. We cannot leave rural airports behind. The focus on DCA is necessary. The families who lost loved ones last year deserve nothing less. That same vigilance belongs everywhere. Each day our members fly into small airports, contract towers, and non-towered fields with GA, medical and military flights, and without the situational awareness tools that are standard elsewhere. We asked Congress to extend risk-based airport safety reviews, equip contract towers with digital tools so controllers don't separate traffic solely by looking out the window, and we re- uh asked Congress to require radio communication at non-towered fields, where it's recommended today, but not required. I thank this committee for embracing AKSX. It's the future of collision avoidance technology. It depends on ADS BN, which gives pilots a real-time picture of nearby traffic. We support both. And we need to be clear-eyed about the timeline. Some suggest ADSBN is ready, fleet-wide, now, and that only ACAS-X is the long-lead technology. That's not accurate. Both need aircraft-specific development, certification, installation, and supply chains that carriers don't control. That's why we support a right-now safety bridge through electronic flight bags that are mounted in the flight deck. They can be used on every flight, fixed in the pilot's line of sight. and an aircraft cannot dispatch without one. EFBs can deliver ADSBN with traffic awareness and surface awareness and visual and audible alerts as in-panel systems mature. We should not wait years for safety we can deploy almost now. Second, workforce. Communities can't get air service without pilots. Supply is more stable now than before, but the underlying shortage remains. Earlier this year, mainline hiring again outpaced new pilot certifications. and we haven't yet fully rebuilt lost air service. And more than a quarter of the workforce must retire within a decade. The pipeline is not keeping up, and one reason is cost. Flight education inherently costs more than other degrees, and federal loans fall about eighty thousand dollars short on average. Students without wealth are locked out. Congress can help by aligning federal student aid with the cost of flight training and allowing GI benefits to cover private pilot certificates. We also support raising the pilot retirement age. It was last raised in two thousand and seven with no safety harm, and pilots already undergo frequent, rigorous testing. This won't end the shortage, but it will help, and it's the right thing to do. Safety depends on pilots being prepared for commercial flight. We're pleased the FAA advanced the congressionally directed enhanced qualification program its safety value lies in the quality, relevance, and rigor. of the training and FAA should implement it with clear standardized guidance. Next, aircraft. Small communities need aircraft size to their markets. Oversized aircraft reduce frequency and reduce routes. Congress should be aware that scope clauses do restrict the size, weight, and number of aircraft regionals can fly. Finally, federal programs. EAS preserves service to many rural communities, and it drove two point three billion dollars in economic activity per year before the pandemic. We urge full funding, stable contracts, and timely transitions. SCASD is another tool to attract and keep air service, and we support it. We appreciate your focus on rural connectivity, and we hope you see us as a partner in the work ahead. Thank you for holding this hearing and for including me in it. I look forward to your questions.
Yeah. Uh, uh, thank you, Miss Black, and thank you for bringing up the pilot shortage. No question about it. But we, we choose Congress fires people at sixty-five and can't justify it for any reason whatsoever. There's nothing, no reason to justify. terminating qualified pilots to testify. Anyway, uh I'd like to uh next uh recognize Mister Doberstein, your recognizer.
Chairman Nils, Ranking Member Carson, and members of the subcommittee, thank you for the opportunity to testify to today. My name is Sean Doberstein, and I serve as the Executive Director of Hector International Airport in Fargo, North Dakota, and as Vice Chair of the American Association of Airport Executives Air Service Committee. I'm here on behalf of airports that depend on reliable Rural Air Service to connect their communities to the national economy, health care, education and commerce. Thank you for the committee's dedication to addressing important aviation matters, especially your contributions to the twenty twenty-four FAA authorization law. This hearing is another example of this committee's commitment to improving aviation in communities, both large and small. Thank you for your continued efforts. Rural Air Service remains under pressure. Recovery at many small communities lagged after the pandemic. And pilot shortages, higher operating costs, including fuel and airline fleet changes, have all made service harder to sustain. In many markets, airlines are using larger aircraft and offering fewer departures, which means fewer connection options, less schedule flexibility, and greater disruption when flights are delayed or canceled. At the same time, rural airports face a major infrastructure challenge. The Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act provided historic airport funding, But that support ends after fiscal year twenty twenty six. Without follow-on investment, airports will face a sharp funding drop, just as they are trying to modernize facilities, improve safety, and prepare for future demand, including new technologies and new entrance into the airspace. Congress took important steps in the FAA Reauthorization Act of twenty twenty four to support small community air service and the modernization of the national airspace system. The next step is to make sure rural airports and the communities they serve are not left behind as the system evolves. To address these challenges, and to protect rural connectivity, I would urge Congress to focus on six priorities. The first, fully fund essential air service. EAS remains the core federal program providing access for communities that would otherwise lose commercial service. Second, strengthen the small community air service development program. SCASD helps communities attract and retain service, but demand continues to outpace available funding. Third, provide stable airport infrastructure funding. Congress should protect AIP and extend IIJA style airport investments, so smaller airports can address safety, terminal, runway and tower needs without facing a funding cliff after fiscal year twenty twenty six. Fourth, Support contract towers. Contract towers improve safety and access to smaller airports. Fifth, support aviation workforce programs. Continued investment in pilots, technicians and controllers is essential to sustaining and growing service. Sixth, accelerate modernization of the air traffic control system. A safer, more efficient system benefits the entire country, but is especially important for smaller communities. which are often the first to lose service when the system is constrained. In conclusion, rural aviation is not a local issue alone, it is a national connectivity issue. If we want a strong and resilient aviation system, we must ensure rural communities remain connected to it. Thank you for your time and your attention to rural aviation issues. I look forward to your questions.
Uh thank you. Uh, Mister Collins, you're recognized.
Chairman Nels, Ranking Member Carson, and members of the subcommittee. Thank you for the opportunity to discuss GAO's work related to air service to small communities in the United States. Communities of all sizes seek access to air service as a driver for attracting investment, generating employment, and providing mobility for citizens. However, the economics of the airline industry has traditionally made it difficult to establish or sustain viable air service in some smaller communities. My remarks will highlight recent trends in air service to small communities, market factors that have contributed to changes in air service to small communities and their effects on federal air service programs, and suggestions from stakeholders and recent studies to improve air service to small communities. In general, small communities continue to face declining passenger air service. From twenty eighteen to twenty twenty-three on average, small communities had fewer total departures annually, and fewer daily departures per route. Over the same time period, small communities' connectivity, a measure of a passenger's degree of access to the national aviation system, also decreased. These trends are more acute at non-hub airports that do not receive essential air service program support. For example, from twenty eighteen to twenty twenty four, over seventy percent of these airports experienced a decline in average daily departures per room. Several market factors have affected air service to small communities. First, consumers have shown that they are willing to drive for cheaper flights or better service. In addition, stakeholders reported that increased airline operating costs made air service to small communities less economically feasible contributing to reductions in air service. These costs have also affected federal air service programs targeted at small communities. From twenty eighteen through twenty twenty three, increased airline operating costs contributed to a thirty-one percent increase in total EAS subsidies for communities in the lower forty-eight states. These costs have also affected the small community air service development program by limiting the impact of the grants that communities use to jumpstart new air service. Options that selected stakeholders in recent studies identified to improve air service to small communities include increasing the aviation workforce supply, and supporting other transportation modes, such as bus service or new technologies such as electric aircraft. In addition, stakeholders identified a range of options to change the essential air service program such as focusing assistance on more remote communities, or expanding the program to better ensure small airports do not lose air service. Stakeholders also identified options to modify the small community air service development program, including allocating funding to fewer communities per cycle or shifting the focus of the program away from revenue guarantees. In conclusion, given limited resources, airlines may allocate those resources for the high highest return. Because of the unique circumstances of each small community airport and market factors, a combination of creative approaches will be needed to ensure connectivity for small communities. This concludes my statement. I'll be happy to answer any questions.
Uh, thank you, sir. I now recognize Mister Pecario. Five minutes.
Thank you, Chairman Nels, ranking member Carson, uh and ranking member Larson, members of the subcommittee. Thank you for the opportunity to appear before you on behalf of the National Association of State Aviation Officials. I appreciate your continued commitment to the small to small community air service, and from your opening statements it's clear that this committee gets it. State agencies directly support small and rural s- air service in many ways, including financially. Several states uh provide incentive programs to help communities attract and retain scheduled passenger service. These efforts complement federal programs providing locally responsive support shaped by each community's needs. The challenges facing small community air service are bigger than any one federal program. The nation needs a coordinated strategy. Small and rural communities face long-standing pressures. Aging infrastructure, airline economics, security requirements, limited workforce, and the shrinking availability of appropriately sized aircraft. Unless these are addressed together, communities will continue to lose service. We need Congress to direct the U. S. D. O. T. and the FAA, in coordination with other agencies and state and local governments, to develop and implement a national strategy for small community air service. That effort should review existing federal programs, identify actionable recommendations, and define clear responsibilities across government. Continued federal support is indispensable. The EAS program is an important lifeline for many communities, but it has not kept pace with changes in the airline industry and the broader economy. Communities that successfully exited EAS before the pandemic are now unable to sustain service under current conditions. Yet existing law makes it extremely difficult for them to re-enter. Congress should preserve full funding for both EAS and the small community air service development program, and update eligibility rules so communi- communities who have lost service have a realistic path back. Infrastructure needs are equally pressing. Many small community terminals are aging, undersized, and un- unable to meet current needs. General aviation airports face similar funding challenges, even though they may provide some of the most practical near-term platforms for emerging aviation technologies and future service opportunities. Congress should continue robust Air Improve Airport Improvement Program funding at the full authorized level and examine long-term changes to better support non-primary entitlements and general aviation infrastructure. The regional aircraft fleet, vital to many small communities, is in decline. Airlines are moving to fewer, larger aircraft with more favorable economics, while many fifty-seat regional jets are reaching the end of their useful lives. When right-sized aircraft disappear, access disappears with them. It becomes harder for smaller markets to maintain frequency, affordability, and reliable connectivity to the national system. We must identify and repair and fix the barriers preventing new regional aircraft from entering the market. Finally, workforce shortages continue to affect the entire aviation ecosystem, especially pilot recruitment and retention. NSEO encourages Congress to continue to support pathways that improve the pilot pipeline. In closing, the challenges facing small community air service are structural, compounding, and urgent, but not beyond solving. With a strategic national approach, continued federal assistance, sustained infrastructure investment, support for right-sized aircraft manufacturing, and expanded workforce development, Congress can help ensure that small communities remain connected to the national aviation system. NSEO and the States stand ready to work with you to ensure that small and rural communities have access to the NASS. Thank you again for your leadership and your continued attention to this important issue. I'd be pleased to answer any questions you may have.
Uh, thank you, sir. Uh, thank you all for your testimony. We will now uh turn to questions from the panel. I'll recognize myself. I think uh just for uh awareness that I think Miss uh Black you brought it up, but the FAA Administrator Brian Bedford testified last week at the Senate Commerce hearing that any new integrated system ACAS X or ADS be in is ten years away, ten years. The electronic flight bag option that you mentioned, Faye, uh can be deployed, it can be done immediately, so just I just wanted to bring that point up. Uh, Miss Black, to the uh in addition to guaranteeing a safely operated national airspace, we have a responsibility to ensure that rural Americans have an accessible national airspace. The necessity of access for regional aircraft is indisputable. Can you describe any obstacles on the horizon for your carriers, and how can Congress hurt, we can hurt, or help?
Thank you for the question. Um, I think that the obstacles on the horizon are related to workforce. Uh certainly we need to have pilots to operate the flights and aircraft related, we need to have the aircraft to operate the flights as well. Um the risks to each workforce obviously is that is that we don't have enough, we see that that pipeline is thinning, there are things that we can do to fix it, uh including right sizing student loans so more people from working class backgrounds can get into this career. And with respect to the fleet, it's important that as we advance safety that we bring it communities of every size but we do it in a way that works with the fleet and not against the fleet or in a way that could ground the fleet so to your point of the electronic flight bag that's a way for us right now to create that level of safety um while we pursue integrated systems that the supply chain may not keep up with. Those are the the biggest uh I think risks right now.
OK. Fair enough. Do you have an estimate on how many pilots the regionals will lose to the major carriers over the next twelve months?
the next twelve months did you say uh i think i actually saw estimates from seven thousand five hundred to eight thousand five hundred or so and to put that into context the pipeline actually produced about uh about that amount last year a little bit less actually and using a twelve month rolling average it looks to
sure
produce about eight thousand or eighty three hundred so we're already behind
sure so so what that really means is that the regionals serve ninety four percent of our our commercial airports Ninety four percent.
Correct.
The main line carriers serve just thirty six percent. So that means regional serve two thirds. They're the only mode of transportation, two thirds of our nation's airports. But yet you're gonna lose all these pilots and we could see that even, we're gonna lose more service to more smaller airports as a result of the pilot shortage it must be addressed this year it's gotta be addressed. Mister Doberstein, Fargo, haven't been there, haven't been there, has received a few uh SCASDAP grant awards. The program is appealing because it incentivizes local of new air services that have the potential to uh continue unsubsidized. How have you been successful and how has the local economy benefited and you have any suggestions to strengthen the program?
Thank you for the question. Um, yeah, we've been the recipient of four SCASTI grants uh dating back to two thousand five. The first grant uh was awarded to us and Delta Airlines implemented service to Salt Lake City. That was done in two thousand six, but unfortunately the service was suspended in two thousand eight, Delta reallocated aircraft to Seattle and Los Angeles for other competitive reasons. Our second grant uh was awarded um for service to Dallas back in two thousand eleven, and that service is thriving today, it's doing extremely, extremely well. Our third grant uh was for Seattle service, working with Alaska Airlines. Fargo had a large population of Microsoft employees in our community that were traveling back and forth to Seattle. Unfortunately, the the pandemic resulted in more virtual use of their time and uh less air travel, so we terminated that grant. And currently today we have a grant uh on the table right now for implementing service to Charlotte and we're working with American Airlines on that. Uh my suggestions would be to uh increase the amount of funding for the SCASD program,
Mm-hmm.
maybe reduce the number of recipients, to increase the amount of money each recipient would receive due to the higher costs that are in place today with workforce, fuel and other things.
Thank you. Mister Collins, we're aware of the ballooning cost to EAS. We've lowered the subsidy cap in the FAA reauthorization. It will help. You have talked about the successes of SCASdap, where projects with a local match are more competitive. Two questions. Uh, would the solvency of EAS benefit from the from the small sort of small local investment? And what else can be done to reduce costs and increase our return on investment in the EAS?
So, wi- with respect to uh EAS costs, we do have ongoing work. uh related to uh looking at uh ideas that stakeholders have uh for uh reducing uh those those costs.
I will now recognize Mister Carson for five.
Thank you, good chairman. Um, I'm curious, I I I oppose the administration's proposal to limit the federal student loans for some of the programs that produce the most qualified pilots. Can you talk about the financial costs uh to becoming a commercial pilot and how updating federal student loan eligibility could level the playing field and attract more diverse talent
uh thank you for the question and for the interest uh you know the first step to becoming a professional pilot is the pilot private uh is a private pilot license so one thing we can do is actually outside the student loan uh program is allow the gi uh bill to fund that today the rules exclude that so that's just a common sense fix that we can make uh to allow the GI Bill those earned benefits to cover the full spectrum uh of pilot training. With respect to student loans, right now uh it can cost you know almost two hundred thousand dollars or so, and flight training is inherently expensive if you think about it. You've got aircraft, insurance, fuel, specialized instructors, so these are not ordinary college costs. And the federal student loan apparatus was just not designed to support those costs. These are great, money, good opportunities. transformational careers, but you gotta be able to get there. Uh, the gulf that the exists between the caps of student loans and the actual cost is upwards of eighty thousand dollars. And so f- with families without access to wealth or private capital, that gap is decisive.
Um, what are the biggest infrastructure needs of small hub and and small airports? Have small airport infrastructure needs evolved because of changes in airline services? IE airlines up gauging from smaller planes to larger planes?
Sorry, the question was to me about the economics of small aircraft?
Everyone.
Yeah. Um, I think this is, this is a complex um, cyclical kind of conversation. Sometimes we hear that uh, the reason that these smaller aircraft are not in the market anymore, is that the economics don't support it. In reality, we had a pilot shortage that absolutely collapsed command. it absolutely collapsed uh capacity. And as a result, the economics changed on those uh smaller uh smaller markets. You have different pilot compensation costs, and by the way I think that was a good and valuable investment, but it did change the economics. And you also have network carriers that are trying to parse a limited supply. And so they do that by up gauging, by seeking to move more passengers at once. The problem is, when you up gauge uh because you have to, because you're trying to, you know,
And and lastly, um, I arthur- I I authored federal requirements for secondary barriers,
Mm-hmm.
controversial at first, um, in commercial passenger aircraft, airlines and aircraft manufacturers have been making progress, but in the last few weeks there have been multiple attempts by unruly passengers uh to try to gain access to the cockpit or other doors. Where are your members Where are you a member of airlines in installing secondary barriers? Is is it still controversial? Has it been more embraced over the years?
I I think i- there's no controversy about the requirement we understand the rule and we intend to comply um what you maybe referencing is the fact that and again this speaks to the supply chain um in the time-line that was provided to comply with this our manufacturer came up with a solution uh but the facts are regional aircraft don't look like mainline aircraft we've got you know different forward lab different set up and so installing a door works on a narrow body or a wide body but you can't install a door on a regional so when that actually came to uh market and was installed we did find some safety and some occupational issues that we had to be uh had to be worked through and so that's why you see some of these requests for an additional period of time to comply uh but the goal is to get those secondary barriers installed and complete and trained
Thank you ma'am. I yield back.
The gentleman yields and I'll recognize Mister Larson.
Thank you Mister Chair, um Mister uh, just a moment. Thought I had w- a little more time. Yeah, uh, mister p- uh, mister um, the Guerrero, like to ask you the same question that was just asked to Miss Black about um, the cost efficiency, fuel efficiency of a fifty to one hundred seater, and whether or not um, whether or not you think that helps to solve the issues. Is that a beneficial option for regional airports, the smaller airports?
Yeah. Thank you uh, Mister Larson, I think, you know, when we think about, when we look at the economics of of air travel, I think it's it's pretty clear that, you know, if you have a s- lar- if you have a larger aircraft going into a community less frequently, what that does is it drives people who wanted to travel on a Tuesday, but the aircraft doesn't leave until Wednesday, to make the choice to drive six or eight hours or whatever it is to to the next commercial airport that they need to get to. Um that's gonna result in fewer people actually taking that aircraft, so instead of having you know reasonably full fifty seat aircraft you're gonna have you know a you know maybe you know a third one third full larger aircraft um you know the airlines are gonna find that less sustainable uh and it creates a cycle where people are gonna make the choice that they're gonna find other ways to get to, Um, what that does to the community is it decreases their access to air service, it uh decreases their access to you know business opportunities, economic development, healthcare delivery services, other professional services, um tourism, and so it creates a vicious cycle and so um you know, I it it's self-defeating in a larger sense, so that's why I think that you know if if aircraft were available and the market could choose the right size aircraft, that were available to fit different communities, uh, you know, we'd see much more robust activity in these communities.
Right, thanks. Um, Mister Collins, I noted in your testimony that, uh, you're s- you have started or you are studying, um, the high school programs that support aviation maintenance technicians and thinking about the workforce. Are you uh, do you have a timeline when you expect to finish that?
We hope to have that work completed in twenty twenty seven. I can reach out to your staff and give you a more direct time frame.
Alright, and related then, have you looked at the uh have we asked you to look at the uh the Aviation Workforce Development Grant program I noted that uh uh the administration has has come out with a no-fo on it and we'll little disappointed with the with the no-fo but have you looked at the grant program that we first created in two thousand eighteen? No, six section twenty-five, six twenty-five grants.
I'll need to get back with your staff to see if we've had any prior work, and then to see if that, uh, grant program will be a part of any upcoming work.
Yeah, great, thanks, I appreciate that, um, very much. Um, Ms. Black, can you explain, um, or no, please explain how this unexpected unexpected fuel shock, um, has impacted carriers?
Absolutely. So there are two business models that govern a re- govern Regional Airline. uh the way that we bring passengers to larger airlines and through the system one is capacity purchase agreement that's where essentially we operate the flight with our aircraft and our crews in maintenance but the major airline sets this the fare and pays the fuel so we're not necessarily directly impacted under those um under those business relationships but the market dynamics are and on a smaller uh smaller flight again with fewer seats over which to absorb cost in a thin market that's already fragile in terms of margins those economists can get to upside down pretty quickly and that's why even though we don't necessarily write the checks for the fuel it can impact the communities that we serve.
Great. And and uh Mister Dobberstein have you seen the impact of that experience in the last twelve to thirteen weeks on the fuel prices?
Uh definitely. Um you know certainly increased cost to our passengers uh in our region. has had an impact uh on their financial ability and so forth, but yeah we definitely have seen an impact on that as well.
So that meant fewer employments um out of Fargo?
Not necessarily, um we've we've been fortunate to have record employments so far since January of this year, but uh we do expect it going forward.
J- just more just more complaints.
More complaints, yes that's correct, sir.
Just more complaints, yeah sure. Um um Thank you. Um Uh, so when we increased the uh, sorry, well, it'll be quick here, when when we increased the AIP to four billion dollars uh annually, we also the uh large portion of the increase went to small, smaller airports. Have you been able to take advantage of that particular set of dollars?
Yes, sir. We're in the middle of a major terminal expansion project in Fargo. It's about a hundred and ten million dollar. And um, yeah, we've been working with our congressional delegation and the FAA to obtain those funds, yes.
That's great. I appreciate it. Thank you very much.
Thank you. Gentleman yields, and I'll recognize Mister Perry.
Thanks, Mister Chairman, and thank the witnesses for being here. The purpose of this hearing is to highlight some of the issues hindering air service to small communities and look at the federal programs intended to support those services. Um, unfortunately, I think, I'd just like to have a discussion about this, we keep on throwing money after um what seems to be economically unfeasible um roots. And these market interventions have in turn created additional problems that we want to address um but the answer always seems to be throw more money at it. And I'm not sure that's the best answer and certainly I don't believe that's the sustainable answer. Uh, it's the inevitable result of a program like EAS and I know each one of you, I think, has supported it and said that we should actually do more of it. But it does allow the government to choose winners and losers based on uh oftentimes political calculations as opposed to actual service needs. The program was created by the E- Airline Deregulation Act of nineteen seventy-eight as a temporary, a reminder of a temporary program, as the industry was deregulated. Uh, it's a perfect example of uh nothing, no government program really being temporary. It's nearly fifty years later and the program remains receiving six hundred and eighty seven point five million dollars in FY twenty six. In recent years, the program costs have skyrocketed skyrocketed, increasing thirty one percent from twenty eighteen to twenty twenty four. And there seems to be little incentive to maximize productivity, um, cuz the government just pays for it. These uh the subsidy does pick winners and losers among airports and communities as neighboring airports compete against those that are subsidized by taxpayers at the federal government level for essentially the same market in many cases, making matters worse. The DOT has approved subsidies for EAS funded leisure routes, creating even more government funded competition for non-EAS airports. Um, moreover, the AS program as well as SCAD's DP program have created perverse incentive for airlines that damage the ability of non- ea s are airports to compete for their subsidized neighbor airports as they are forced into a pay-to-play revenue guarantee scheme just to attract the service. Now Congress has acknowledged the unfairness of these subsidies and for neighboring airports when creating the program, and it's structured it to alleviate the most obvious economic harm created by the issue, which is banning access to EAS subsidies within seventy miles of a medium of medium and large hub airports and placing reasonable restrictions within a hundred and seventy-five miles. Those restrictions have not applied to small hub airports, however, and the those are the ones that have far more limited financial resources to withstand the competition. Um, and they could actually benefit for uh from an additional employment. As a result, the end we end up with absurd outcomes like you have in the district that I'm honored to represent, where Harrisburg International Airport is forced to compete with an EAS subsidized airport thirty two miles away. I'm not trying to punish that airport. I mean, I'm happy for those folks and I've I've landed at the airport. We we're happy that it's there. But but I have to defend the airport and the airport system that I represent. Uh, this is uh to Mister Collins. Do you think applying the pre-existing restrictions to small hub airports would help foster a more fair environment that doesn't force airports to compete with neighboring funded, neighbors that are funded by their own tax dollars.
So we've not taken a position on that particular issue. Ultimately, those are
Yeah, but I have to take a position on that issue.
things for Congress.
So we're here to discuss that, and then it'd be great if the experts, so to speak, would weigh in with something other than, yeah, the situation sucks but we don't have an answer so you all figure it out that's why we're having to like that it's essentially what we're saying here right so can you i mean you're saying you don't take does anybody take a position on it
so what i what i can say is in our discussions with stakeholders some have noted that perhaps with eas it should be uh targeted to those uh communities that are quote unquote truly remote uh which again is a a decision for uh congress to make But to your point, there are voices that uh understand that the subsidies can create distortions in the market and you know ultimately again it's up to you all to decide uh which
Well, it'd be good to have some like some information from you folks that live this day in and day out. Look, I I'm a fan of airports, I used to fly and land at them, we're not building any new ones, so we wanna retain the ones that we have. We all get that. But what market-based reforms do you think that can be made to help these airports grow without throwing, you know, more tax dollars to make them compete against the the very money that they earn uh against their competitors just a few miles away? And like I said, we're not mad at their competitors, we want them to remain too. But there's gotta be some market-based approaches because the government has sought to fix this problem. They haven't fixed the problem, and the answer is to throw more money at it,
The gentleman's run out of time. You may have to send him an email. Uh, I now recognize Miss Scholten for five minutes.
Thank you so much, Chair Nils and uh, Ranking Member Carson, for holding this really uh important hearing. The Essential Air Service program is truly a lifeline in my district and throughout other portions of rural America. Muskegon County Airport is a key connector to West Michigan, and since changing EAS providers, the airport and surrounding region has seen incredible growth. In just one year, MKG has seen a fifty-five percent increase in passenger activity. Uh, through support from the EAS program, employment at the airport has increased by nearly two hundred percent, putting it on a clear path to return to primary airport status. Additionally, the airport has made measurable progress in reducing its EAS support from four hundred and eighty-four per passenger in twenty twenty-five to an expected three hundred dollars or less in twenty twenty-six. This is significant progress, and it's why I'm so concerned about proposed statutory changes to the EAS program outlined in the president's FY twenty twenty seven budget. The proposed changes would eliminate EAS budget uh eligibility for communities within seventy five miles of small medium or large hub airports. Additionally, the language would eliminate program eligibility for communities whose per passenger subsidy exceeds three hundred and fifty dollars in the most recent fiscal year, regardless of distance from the hub. The if the president's proposals were enacted, rural communities including Muskegon would be cut off from critical aviation and effectively the rest of the country. The demands for these services are real and will not simply disappear. Costs would, uh, costs will be displaced onto residents and businesses looking to grow their workforce. Uh, Mister Pecarrero, can you please speak to the economic impacts associated with successful use of EAS programs as well as how limiting access to the program would hurt local job growth and tourism.
Thank you, Ms. Sultan. Uh, first let me thank you for mentioning the Seeghan County Airport. It is a great success story uh in uh Michigan and we're very pleased at how well they're doing there. I would note that in Michigan, in addition to that, uh Michigan DOT's Office of uh Aeronautics operates a commercial air service development program providing annual grants to commercial service airports across four areas, capital improvements in equipment, air carrier recruitment and retention, airport marketing, aircraft rescue firefighting training. State engagement in these uh in these opportunities is critical for airports, and I think that you know in Michigan we're seeing great examples of how that works, and you know we love to see what we love to see it when state aviation agencies have the resources to be able to support those types of programs. And I think that that's a great example of what's necessary to to the point of your question, is that you know, we need a holistic approach to solving this problem. The, the, it's, it's bigger than any one, your airport, any one, any one federal program, any one state. You know, there needs to be a larger approach to this to really try and get to these whole, this whole range of problems in order to make an airport uh ecosystem healthy. And so that's what we're encouraging and that's what we support today.
It's absolutely what we're seeing on the ground uh as well, so thank you for that. Uh, uh keeping on with the e- economic development, uh, families across the nation are feeling the pain at the gas pump. As the president continues unauthorized military action in Iran, um, you know, we are so proud of the War Powers Resolution that we got passed uh in the House of Representatives yesterday to give the people their their voice over this issue. In the aviation sector, fuel is a major operating expense, so increased prices could drive up costs. While higher fuel prices may not always result in a complete loss of service, they can absolutely make it more difficult to operate smaller airco- aircrafts on routes that already have really thin margins. You know I'm coming to you, Miss Black. Uh, you're already nodding. In your written testimony, you touch on the threat of jet fuel prices to small communities. Can you describe how fuel costs, uh, influence decisions about route frequency, air ca- aircraft deployment uh and service to smaller communities.
I'm gonna start with the mechanics of the um of the cost, because that's the part that we control. Um and when you deploy a small aircraft, whether that's fifty or seventy-six seats, you know you don't amortize the cost, whether it's labor or fuel, the same way that you do over a hundred and thirty-five, a hundred and fifty, three hundred seats, right? So the math is just very different. And when you're going into small communities, they have fewer passengers traveling, so these are already fragile markets. And in that way, it can become um unprofitable very quickly, so it's not just a matter of our costs are lower here, but we're actually in the red. Um where those actual deployment decisions lie are with our major airline partners, but we can tell you that when can when capacity is extracted from the system, it's typically regional capacity and it's typically the smaller communities that are impacted first, in part because that Inconvenience is the fewest amount of travelers, but unfortunately, for those in rural communities it can be very painful.
Good. Thank you. Same over my time, so I'll yield back. Thanks for the response.
Mister Stauber, you're recognized. Chairman Nels, Ranking Member Carson, let's get some spice into this meeting. We're talking about rural America, rural airports, Fargo, Duluth, Hibbing, Bramidji, Brainerd, International Falls, they matter. Our rural communities matter. I'm so proud of each and every one of you talking about rural America and rural aviation. Our communities need it. And this is a bipartisan issue. The vast majority of us support rural America, rural aviation, the connection, therefore. We're not taking a backseat. None of you at that diocese are taking a backseat. And I'm so proud of you. Mister Doberstein, hundred million dollars in fargo. That's spectacular. We have twenty million dollar investment in the third oldest control tower in America, the Duluth Air Traffic Control Tower. We're getting a brand new one, twenty-first century. I'm excited about these programs, and I'm excited to invest in rural America. We've taken a backseat long enough. I know each and every one of you are proud of your rural airports in Michigan. They matter to those communities. We shouldn't have to drive six or eight hours. We shouldn't have the air airline saying we're gonna bring bigger uh uh aircraft, three hundred seat aircraft, we're not filling them, so we're only gonna come every third day or every. We need everyday service in our rural communities. And one of the li- one of the questions that was asked was the the fifty seat passenger aircraft. Maybe mayb- maybe we should talk to uh the a- aircraft manufacturers and work on getting more because We s- our our rural air- air- airports serve the metro, the major ones. The value that we, the rural aviation brings to our economies and to the United States of America is incredible. You folks are the best spokespersons for that, and I'm proud of you. Mister Doberstein, how do federal investments in rural and regional airport infrastructures like the Duluth Air Traffic Control Tower help grow surrounding communities and ensure the viability of regional flights for the foreseeable future.
Thank you Congressman for the for the question. Well, it's imperative. I guess my mantra has always been that it it takes three entities to support infrastructure investment in rural airports. It's the federal government, it's the state government, as well as the local community. Without those three working together, it'd be impossible to fund airport infrastructure projects of the magnitude that we're doing in Fargo.
and other small rural communities around the country.
Yeah, it's it's that it's that uh partnership, that you say local, state and federal. That's exactly what we did in uh Duluth's ATC. Uh, Mister Pecquerelle, uh in what ways can programs like the essential air service and the small community air service development program adapt to meet the needs of the community the specific issues within the communities?
Thank you uh, Mister Stauber, that's a um that's an important uh question, I think that The way that, you know, we'd like to see, you know, both EAS and small community air service program work together, is to look at the look at the larger needs of these communities and figure out in the in the many years since you know these programs have been created, how has the industry changed? And I think that's a critical point to make, you know, the the way that the airline industry operated forty years ago or more when these programs were created is very different than it is today. And so the way we're gonna serve these communities, and support them is gonna be very different than it was back then. And so that's what's necessary, is to bring together all the stakeholders, including state and local governments, to sit down with uh federal agencies uh to figure out exactly what we need to do to retool these programs to make them more cost efficient to make sure that there is local support for them because we don't expect the federal government to do it all by itself um and to make sure that we're able to provide the type of service that all these communities need.
You know, and I I I appreciate that answer. I like uh the ability for our local community regional airports to make some of the decisions themselves, not be tied uh so tight to demands. I I I I think you'd agree. Allow our local communities to have some flexibility uh in their design or or or passenger experience. Would you agree with that?
Yes, sir. And we also think that, you know, looking to the future, that uh general aviation airports uh also have an important role to play, particularly as emerging aeronautical technologies provide
Mm-hmm.
some new opportunities for people to access the aviation system.
Yeah. Yeah. Well, listen, I I I'm so uh excited uh I I couldn't wait for this hearing uh because you are all proponents of what we believe in rural aviation. We we're not gonna take a backseat, okay? We're gonna be loud and proud supporting our our small rural communities, because we matter. Those of us who live in rural America matter. And you guys are in the uh in the fight with us and I know that the Chairman and Ranking Member are as well on your back.
Love the passion, Pete, I love it. Uh, Miss Gillen, you're recognized.
Thank you, Mister Chairman, and thank you, Ranking Member, and thank you to our witnesses uh for being here today. I am proud to represent New York's fourth congressional district on the south shore of Long Island, which is the home to TRACON N ninety, which manages the most complex and congested airspace in our country. As I saw firsthand when I visited, this facility relies on outdated technology, um, posing a serious safety risk for the region and for our skies across the country. We must do more to invest in the safety of our airspace and give our controllers the resources that they need. It's equally important that we invest resources in our airport towers, large and small. Uh, my district abuts two of the most busy hubs in the country, JFK and LaGuardia uh Airport, but also smaller airports on the east end of Long Island, um and I believe all of these airports deserve our support. The smaller airports partic- participate in the FAA's contract tower program, which allows the airports to contract out uh operation of their towers to save these systems money and enhance safety. Unfortunately, many of these contract towers lacks lack access to real-time situational awareness tools that are now the standard at the larger airports and that enhance the controllers' visibility of aircraft operations. Last month, my colleague, Congressman Baigich, and I worked together to introduce the bipartisan Air Traffic Situational Awarement Awareness Enhancement Act which would help close this gap by requiring the FAA to acquire and install these tools at contract towers and establish a training program to ensure controllers effectively integrate and use them. I appreciated uh Ms. Black mentioning this important initiative in her testimony. So, Ms. Black, I'd like to give you a chance to speak a little bit about this important issue, and how critical it is that we address the safety gap and move our legislation through Congress.
Thank you, Congressman, and thank you uh very much for your bill. Um, when we talk about air traffic control modernization at smaller communities, sometimes that just means doing the basics. And as you recognized, uh, some of the towers don't have radar. They don't have ADSBN in the tower. They don't have that advanced digital situational awareness. And so they're looking out the window to separate aircraft visually. That is risk in the system, and it's something that we can mitigate right now. Your bill would do it. We're strong supporters. Um, and count on us to help you advance it, because it should be passed.
Well, thank you. I appreciate that. And as I mentioned, TRACON N ninety, the air traffic and control facility for managing the New York airspace is located in my district, and N ninety controllers are responsible for managing air traffic in and out of two of the busiest airports in the world JFK and LaGuardia. In addition to the smaller regional airports in the region, like Republic Airport in Farmingdale and MacArthur Airport in Islip. Despite their role managing the busiest airspace in the country, the N ninety facility is among the most outdated and understaffed. While our aerospace industry continues to innovate and evolve, our controllers at N ninety still work with floppy disks and paper strips. Uh, Mister Doberstein, in your testimony you mentioned the impact of air traffic control constraints on smaller communities like yours. Can you elaborate more on the problems that these smaller communities face today because of our lack of investment?
Well, one example would be the um reduction in our frequencies to Chicago. Earlier this year, one of our carriers announced that they were going to add service to Chicago, additional capacity opportunities for our passengers, and then as the cap came in place between the FAA and Chicago O'Hare, uh those flights were taken out. So our community is gonna miss out on that additional frequencies and opportunities for our traveling public in our region.
Yeah. Thank you. Uh, Mister Pecoraro, you spoke in your testimony about the potential of advanced air mobility to transform how people and goods are moved. I've met with AAM companies and I'm excited by the
Thank you, Miss Gillen. Yes, um, you know, briefly I'll just say that, uh, we think that, uh, while AAM is not a short-term solution, certainly it has tremendous potential in the longer term. to provide a great deal of additional access for people in a cleaner and quieter fashion. And we think that's gonna certainly important, particularly in uh in you know districts like yours where that's a concern of many residents. We think that one of the most exciting parts in the in the short term, shorter term, of providing this type of access is for fixed wing hybrid aircraft, you know, to be able to provide, you know, regional aircraft, you know, uh, w- as we're talking about, you know, access to smaller communities, to maybe you know sub um support or uh replace some of the um you know aircraft that um you know we were talking about earlier that are you know phasing out of their life life cycle
thank you i look forward to working with you on this going forward
thank you
channel eighty yields and i'll recognize mister alwin
thank you thank you mr. chairman and remember appreciate today's hearing on connecting rural america to the national air force base uh systems and the chance to look hard at whether our policies are actually deliver delivering for small communities. We rightly tout the safest, most advanced airfare a- airspace in the world, but too many of our rural families, the more basic question is whether they can access it at all. When small town uh airports lose meaningful service, and the only option becomes hours on the road to reach a hub, that means lost jobs, missed medical ap- appointments, and young people will have to simply stay home instead of chasing opportunity. And small businesses and local economies that depend on these flights feel it immediately. In the twenty twenty four FAA reauthorization, Congressman President Trump laid out a road map for rural aviation, strengthening essential air service and increasing uh airport improvement funding for airports that keep rural America connected. The FAA now has more authority in in resources to support small communities than it has had in years. And I appreciate the professionals that uh there who are trying to put these tools to work. The folks back home judge success not by what they they judge success by what they see on the departure board uh not by what's written on in statue. They see flights disappearing from small and non-hub airports, they see fares that climb faster in smaller markets than big hubs, and they see airlines c- consolidating services services into a handful of major airports. The message we hear is is simple, if federal support and subsidies are on the table, the need to translate it to real opportunities for rural travelers not just the good intentions. I look forward to hearing from our witnesses today uh what target steps this subcommittee and the Trump administration should take uh next to make sure rural Americans get more than just a s- a few promises on paper uh with that, I'll move on to my questions. Uh, Ms. Black, in the uh rural it's rural states like Utah, many small airports never see a regional uh jet, may never see a regional jet again, but they may res- res- but they could receive or support advanced air mobility and point-to-point connectivity that underserved communities need. With companies like Beta Technologies already active in Utah, a head of Olympics and DOT, DOT uh leadership, publicly public publicly highlighting these opportunities, what does the regional airport industry need to see from Congress to ensure small airports are not left behind as AAM scales? And what um and are we putting the right infrastructure and certification framework in place to make that happen.
Thank you for the question. We're very excited about AM technology. Um, unlike a lot of the investments, it's coming to market on the smaller side of capacity, on the regional side, so we're excited about it. Um, at the same time, some of these developments are five, ten years away, so we do still need to have investment in the fleet that can serve markets right now. In terms of helping airports prepare for bringing this technology online, I think some of the support may be financial. Um, they need to be able to meet the needs of the new aircraft, having charging infrastructure, um, change the way that we're dealing with propulsion, uh, in the maintenance. And so I think in, you know, continuing to look at that will be really important. At the FAA, it's important that they have the ability to certify these new technologies as they come online and help to integrate them into the system safely.
OK. Uh, Mr. Collins, uh, GAL has been tracking small community air f- service for years. If you look strictly at the data since twenty twenty-four, FAA re- real real authorization, including new subsidy caps, uh, SCA SPD increases, and AIP changes. Do you see any early signs that these reforms are stabilizing the service at small and non-hub airports? Or we still on the same downward trajectory in terms of departure and connectivity?
Our work has shown that we're still on the same uh downward trajectory. I think one of the challenges with the SCASDAP grants is um you know they're facing uh cost pressures and can't always uh provide the uh minimum revenue guarantees that airlines uh are demanding and uh that makes it difficult for them to uh attract and then once they've attract continue service.
OK. Uh Mister B- uh B- uh Bikara OK. Uh setting federal policies aside for a moment, what is the most effective thing state av- aviation agencies can do right now with its tools already in hand to strengthen rural air service. Whether it's that's targeted state grant programs, coordinated marketing, or smart assistant planning, what does a gold standard state playbook look like in your view?
Um, thank you, Mister Owens. Um, certainly, you know, system planning is always critical, you know, to be able to look ahead and understand what the changing needs of the community are going to be so that we can help those local airports plan for that service is, is always critical. Um, the second most important thing, I think, is the partnership the state aviation agencies have with the federal, with the FAA. You know, uh, state agencies work closely with the FAA from the headquarters to the regional offices to the you know airport district offices to make sure that the right funds are flowing to airports uh in in accordance with that system plan so that we can try and meet the infrastructure needs of those airports. And that's, you know, that's a a great deal of what, you know, state uh agencies are concerned with is trying to make sure that the beyond that and i would say looking to the future yeah we've gotta look to uh you know how we wanna develop the airports of the future and so we appreciate this committee in the reauthorization bill you're creating planning grants so that uh you know airports and state aviation agencies are gonna be looking at those issues in the near term so they will be be prepared for the future
thank you and now you're back
chairman yields and now recognized miss titus
thank you mr. chairman Um, I represent the first district in Nevada. That's the heart of southern Nevada, includes Las Vegas, but you also have the Henderson Airport and the Boulder City Airport, and the traffic is increasing to both of those. General aviation has people come in to Las Vegas for all these big events that we are anticipating. Uh, we've got forty million visitors a year, and ta- travel and tourism contribute eighty-six billion dollars to our So this is the key to our success and survival. Uh, as a member of this committee, I've always had a priority to get uh, be sure that everybody has access. We want people to come from everywhere to Las Vegas. So if it's small town, rural, big city, we want them to have that kind of access that's convenient and affordable. And we know that their experience in Las Vegas begins the minute they get to the airport or get on the plane, it doesn't start once they get to the to the strip.
Mm.
So a federal assistance like the Small Community Air Service, let me get this right, Small Community Air Service Development Program has helped people from all kind of different regions. I think a couple of years ago, s- both Salem, Oregon and Corpus Christi, Texas received some of this funding that supported marketing and uh revenue sharing for Las Vegas routes. So let can I ask you, Miss Black, how would you speak to the contribution of regional airlines to supporting uh, travel and tourism? How does travel and tourism impact your members' decisions of what routes to add, and are there any emerging markets that you all are looking at or changing up like uh, southern Nevada?
Thank you for the question. Um, regional air service to the smallest communities alone, I'll start with a big one. is the economic impact. It drives a hundred and fifty-three billion dollars in yearly economic activity. And that's probably a conservative estimate because we weren't able to capture all the downstream that you're talking about that really does generate. But the part that is missing from that equation is the quality of life, and the ability to connect to places like Las Vegas from wherever you are. Uh sometimes we treat driving and flying like it's neutral exchange and it's not. It's actually there's a safety benefit as well uh because last year almost forty thousand people lost their lives on the highways flying is much safer so air transportation is part of a safer transportation system um when it comes to the programs that support it eas similarly is a force multiplier it drove two point three billion dollars of acti act uh economic activity uh before the pandemic supported seventeen thousand jobs these are just some of the ways that air service is extremely valuable and we should continue to to uh keep supporting it
well thank you you know part of this access to affordability. And so I'd ask you, Mister Collins, we have seen that domestic airfare from most of the small communities has increased at a higher rate than from the major carriers. Is there a a reason for that for in domestically and something we need to be doing to address it to help with that situation?
So we've not done specific work uh looking at uh the changes in uh airfares. What I can say is that, you know, generally the increased operating costs of having an effect uh uh for all routes uh within the country.
Uh, I know that's true, but the I think w- there's some statistics that show it's increased more for these small regional airlines than for the the bigger ones. I thought maybe there's a reason for that.
Yeah, we've not done any work to to specify that.
Just the economies of scale, maybe. OK, well Domestic travel is more important than ever right now because international tourism is down. Uh, we certainly see it from Canada and Mexico and Las Vegas and all across the country, people aren't coming here. It's it's more expensive, the gas is higher, the rhetoric is negative, the visa process is lengthy and complicated. We're adding fees to national parks. That's that's not helping with tourism. adding uh requirements for looking at your social media to get a visa, that's not helpful for tourism. So the more y'all can do internally, um the better. I would just mention real briefly getting the TIFIA eligibility in the recent move two fifty bill seems to be uh something that will will perhaps help you with the infrastructure of your airports are y'all involved in that or aware of that or
Uh, yes ma'am. You know, that's certainly a valuable tool that many airports use.
OK.
And I would just say if I could, you know, Elko Airport in Nevada, I'm not sure if that's in your district,
No, it's not, but I'm not aware of it.
but that's that's been one of the the real success stories using the small community air service, uh, program to restore mid-day service to the airport.
Great, then you don't have to drive all that way on the loneliest highway to get from Elko to Reno.
Yes, ma'am.
It's a long way. Thank you very much. Now you're back.
Channel Lady Yields, and I'll recognize Mister Barrett.
Thank you, Mister Chairman. Uh, thank you all for your testimony. And uh, I think as we uh look at the nature of what we're discussing today, too often we talk about rural communities like the area that I serve or other small towns and medium-sized communities across our country, especially in the Midwest, we call those flyover country. Well, those aren't flyover country. They're areas where people take off and land and go about their business that they need to connect to the uh national airspace and get to their destination you know i take the flight from lansing here to washington d. c. right you know from my district close to home and can arrive here safely and in time for you know the responsibilities in the business of the day that i have here as a member of congress and that's an important thing that i appreciate and other people are on that flight you know they're connecting to somewhere else at washington d. c. or whether they're they have business here connecting our state capital with our nation's capital is an Um, but that's true of every, you know, regional airport we have throughout our country, that it connects people to the places they need to go or to the next stop in their travel ultimately to their final destination. Um, mister uh uh Pecker- Peckeraro, right, did I say that correctly? I know you were talking to my uh colleague, Miss Colton, about some of the synergy between uh the state of Michigan and our aviation office there and some of the federal programs and everything. I was curious um, one of the things we're proud of in in Michigan and Lansing in particular, is there's this shared collaboration with Lansing Community College around their uh maintenance um program they have through Lansing Community College at a uh uh municipal airport outside of Lansing that they train students on uh for aircraft maintenance that can be a tremendous career and can help kind of break through some of that shortage that we have now and was curious if you had any Thoughts on that or any of the uh work that's being done through kind of an innovative way that we've seen in in my district.
Sure. Thank you, Mr. Barrett. I don't know the specif specifics of that particular, you know, relationship, but I do know that as I've traveled around the country, you know, visiting with state aviation agencies and and talking with them, that is not an uncommon relationship, and that you find frequently that, you know, state aviation agencies, local airports, um, local educational facilities, particularly those who are providing you know, that type of aeronautical training have developed really valuable partnerships because nowhere else nowhere more than so that in aviation do people appreciate the tremendous importance of building that pipeline for the workforce early on, and trying to bring young people into the industry and and, you know, bring them into these really good paying jobs and
Yeah. Yeah.
keep them in the community doing those jobs.
Yeah, great careers that they can do at a uh at an affordable tuition rate, close to home, maybe they can still live at home while they're completing this uh program.
Absolutely.
It is ranked currently as the best in the Midwest, that's something we're very proud of and would uh pre- you know encourage.
Yes.
Anytime you'd like to come visit we'd love to have you,
Thank you, I love that.
so we'll see it. Um and uh appreciate that. Uh Miss Black, I had a a question for you, I know you mentioned earlier in your testimony about um the Montgomery GI Bill and some of the limitations around flight training there. Um I know that we do have an ability right now to use the GI Bill for flight training, but there are annual caps around that. Uh, I happen to also serve on the VA committee, which of course is not the subject directly of jurisdiction, but uh, just um last month we reported a bill favorably out of committee that would increase that cap to where it's not running on an annual basis. It would be a a a a cap for the entirety of the benefit. Would that, it would be a hundred thousand dollar um lifetime cap, more or less, that you could take at your own pace to achieve that you need obviously there are limitations on that we want accredited programs so that people are getting real benefit out of that would that help resolve the issue that you've described?
yes it does help anything that starts to right size the ability to finance the education for the actual cost of the education is very helpful um one of the most important things that can be helpful there though is allowing that gi bill to be used for the first phase of
Mm-hmm.
Right now the rules preclude using for that, and that's the gateway, and that can cost twenty thousand or more dollars, so it's prohibitive expense for people to cover out a pocket just to get in,
Yeah.
so that is something that would be very effective. And if I may, no fly over country, we have built our business around landing at
Yeah.
the places where other people fly over, so thank you for saying that.
Yeah. Thank you. Last question, uh, with the time I have left, I know you mentioned, uh, some of the issues with ADSB and other things we've taken on a considerable amount of uh effort here after the tragedy that we had here over Washington DC's airport about a year and a half ago. Um yesterday I had a meeting with some airline pilots in who are from my district who said that ACAS technology could be you know a considerable number of years away whereas we've seemed to be taking testimony that it is closer far closer than that maybe within the next year. Do you have any thoughts on where that stands? It's a technology gap, if it's a hardware gap, or if it's something that we can integrate more
i i would start with saying you know that the acas x is the end goal we support it we thought the committee looked at the advanced technology um there is a
mmm
misconception out there that only acas x is the long lead technology in fact for a lot of the fleet including almost all of the regional airline fleet there is not right now a certified product for adsb in for regional so we support that but what we suggest is a bridge that allows us to get right now
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Apologies for running late.
Gentlemen yields, I now recognize Miss Norton.
Thank you. Uh, I have been working for years to combat aviation noise in the District of Columbia. Twenty the twenty twenty-four federal aviation administration reauthorization law included my provision requiring the Government Accountability Office to conduct a study of helicopter noise in the national capital region. This the study, which was published in March of this year, recommended that the Army, Navy, Air Force, and the Department of Homeland Security develop and implement awareness and outlaw programs for communities affected by helicopter noise in the National Capital Region. Uh, Mister Collins, what progress have these agencies made in implementing this recommendation?
So, uh, DOD agreed with our recommendations and they are planning to provide us with a corrective action plan uh later this month, and that plan will outline the steps that each service will take to implement the recommendations. And so we can uh keep you and your staff uh apprised uh once we receive the plan.
Thank you. I yield back.
General Lady yields. I now recognize Mister Bresnahan.
Thank you, Mister Chairman. This hearing hits home for Pennsylvania's eighth congressional district. Northeastern Pennsylvania is home to the Wilkes-Barre Scranton International Airport. as well as smaller general aviation hubs like Hazleton Regional, Mount Pocono, Cherry Ridge, Flying Dollar, and Wyoming Valley. Non-airport hubs like AVP uh don't always make it into national conversations, but are just as critical to the region's connectivity and economic vitality. Uh, NEPA Interstate Rail Service, not yet, has limited intercity bus options, which means aviation isn't just a convenience for my constituency. it is a lifeline. I'm glad this subcommittee is taking the time today to focus on the challenges facing small and rural communities and make sure they are not left behind. One of the most pressing issues facing AVP, Wilkes-Barre Scranton International Airport, is the FAA has proposed the decommissioning of the Masler approach lighting system on popular runway four. Miss Black, regional carriers like Piedmont are the ones actually flying into airports like Wilkes-Barre Scranton. Uh, AVP has shared concerns that the decommissioning of these mausers will lead to higher approach minimums, reduced capacity, more cancellations, and ultimately lost service. From your perspective, how does degraded approach infrastructure or safety infrastructure in general factor into an airline's decision to maintain or reduce service at non-hub airports? And is this a pattern that you're seeing at other small community airports across the country?
Mister Bresnahan, thank you for the question. I'm gonna avoid commenting on the specifics of that because I'm I'm not uh very well aware of it, but I will talk generally um having that infrastructure at smaller airports is critical, and ensuring that we bring not just you know decommissioning but we actually bring modernization to airports of all sizes is very important. Um small airports that have limited runway size, that impacts the kind of aircraft that you can attract to the airport so
Mm-hmm.
we wanna make sure that we're moving in the right direction in making investments in our small community airports.
Are you seeing any other airports that uh any of your membership companies operate out of that have seen disruptions because of inadequate, upgrades to a specific facility?
Um, I'll give you an example of a public-private partnership that developed an exa in response to exactly that kind of a disruption in Coeur d'Alene, which I believe just has um cargo uh in this specific airport needed to have a tower and you know for years they petitioned to get the tower and then they took matters into their own hands and the airline and the community came together and they actually constructed a tower so the answer is yes and there are some examples that show it
oh i appreciate it and i know we're all excited about the massive down payment this committee has made in atc modernization billions of dollars are currently being invested to and we've seen real capacity and efficiency gains
Uh, thank you for the question, Congressman. Um, I don't believe so, I I think there's more that can be done for the non-hub and small hub airports around the country to invest in that infrastructure Fargo being one of them uh we're coming up on an aging air traffic control facility in our community. and are looking for ways to make improvements or replace that control tower just as they are in Duluth Minnesota right now.
What does the modernization picture look like on the ground at smaller airports? And where do you see the biggest gaps? And what do you think Congress and specifically this committee could be doing a better job to help those small community airports?
In terms of technology, you know, just uh making certain that the most uh up-to-date technology is available in terms of radar. coverage, the equipment that is in the control towers that the controllers are working with, is up to date, and and uh the most efficient that can be available for them. Uh that the training for those controllers is efficient, uh for the size airport that they're working and the airspace that they're responsible for. Um and in terms of things on the ground, you know we're looking at VMAT as well, the transponders for our vehicles, for aircraft in our tower. We're working with suppliers right now on trying to implement that, yet this summer, so that we can become more safe as well. So anything to improve safety, this committee's done a lot of work to improve safety, both the House and the Senate, and we certainly appreciate that investment and look forward to more investment in those technologies that can improve safety whether it's at the tower or on the ground that protect my employees as well as those that are on the aircraft, um patronizing our airport.
Well, I appreciate the feedback and to all the witnesses, thank you for being here with that. Mister Chairman, uh yield.
Gentlemen yields, I now recognize Mister Herd.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman, I wanna circle back on something that my colleague from Nevada had mentioned about airport infrastructure financing I represent Colorado's third district, it's about half of the state's geographic footprint, um it's quite large and airports are a critical part not just for transportation but also they are economic lifelines in western and southern Colorado. Um we've heard discussion about the one hundred and seventy-five billion dollar infrastructure gap at airports across the country. in large cities as well as in communities like those that I represent. And I worked with my colleague, Mister Garimendi, across the aisle on the TIFIA Financing Certainty Act. I'm pleased that that was a part of the Build America Two-Fifty Act that we passed out of this committee, just a few weeks ago. Um, Mister Dobberstein, can you talk a little bit about rural airports taking advantage of financing tools such as TIFIA? Um, how how important is this to ensure that um, important projects go from ideas to reality.
Well, Congressman, thank you for the question. First of all, thank you and the committee for uh including TIFIA in the highway bill. That that's very important. Um, I believe and triple A believes that the program needs to be extended. It it's a critical tool for airports to have at their disposal as they look to finance important and critical infrastructure projects at their airport to improve safety and capacity and enhance uh the experience for our our traveling public so um i'd also do believe that possibly more education needs to be provided to airports so that they understand the tiffia program and what's available to them uh as this is a tool in their toolkit to finance important projects
alright not everyone is aware of it or aware of how it might be used
correct
ok great we can definitely do a better job in in that regard uh mr. pecoraro uh next question for you workforce development and retention are one of the most critical issues in aviation and uh rural communities like those that I represent feel that the hardest oftentimes pilot works for shortages are um forcing communities to see reduced service as a result um they also have challenges keeping key staff beyond pilots, air traffic controllers, specialist TSA, security specialists um aircraft maintenance is another issue um gate agents and so on having a strong workforce pipeline is key to ensuring that we have the strong supply of employees needed to support expanded opportunities for passenger service. I wanted to ask you specifically about a a particular technology that's of interest to us in the west which is and it could be promising on the air traffic control front which is remote towers which allow air traffic control officials to remotely direct traffic to non-towered rural airports. In my mind, this allows for the extra layer of security and certainty that ATC provides, but also gives some flexibility to rural airports uh to meet their individual needs, how can Congress leverage innovative technologies like remote air traffic control to better serve small and rural airports like those in western and southern Colorado?
Right. Thank you very much for that question, Mr. Hurd. We at Naseo think that uh c- that those k- types of towers are a critical part of the future. and and are gonna be very important to aviation safety going forward as, yeah, as you know, Colorado was a leader in this area, and we were very disappointed when, you know, the earlier round of uh research into uh into these towers didn't didn't, you know, work out with the FAA. Uh, there was a great uh facility in Colorado where they were working on it as well as one in uh Leesburg, Virginia. Both showed tremendous potential. We're glad that it's in the, we're glad it's in the reauthorization bill that you all passed, we're glad that the fa is moving forward again on relaunching that effort and we think that uh there's a tremendous potential uh for creating safety at a lot of airports so can't afford a regular tower or a contract tower uh that just can provide uh avenues for uh for aviation safety and uh for you know people to understand what's happening you know on the ground at these airports
amen and agreed we need to keep pushing thank you uh very much for that uh miss malarkey black Uh, as I mentioned earlier, airports are a gateway to jobs, uh, economic, they're an economic lifeline, healthcare, education, tourism, business opportunities, all those things. Um, they are not only home to regional airline services, but also business aviation operators, air ambulances, agricultural aviation, flight schools, and other users as well. From your perspective, how does the loss of regional airline service affect the long-term viability of these smaller airports and their economic outlook?
I think you just look at the, thank you for the question. If you look at the headlines from when regional airlines had to park a quarter of our fleet, and capacity dropped out, it was communities are in crisis, and you saw airport directors that were cra- talking to the press, talking about what a calamity it was, this is not just an economic impact, but it's a real decisive change to the quality of the life that people live there. So I think it's very harmful, um, when when there's a uh a a problem that, with with the regional service. and with the air service at the airport.
Great. Thank you very much for that. Uh, Mr. Chairman, I see my time has expired.
Yes, sir. Uh, Mister Nott, you're recognized.
Thank you so much, Mr. Chairman. It's great to be here. This is an important topic. And uh, I represent sort of the triangle region of North Carolina and east, which is a uh, it's a it's a fertile ground for rural airports. And I have an interesting story. My grandfather a number of years ago actually uh came back from World War Two and sent a request to Mister Cessna about how to construct an airport. He had put together various parcels of land and uh Mister Cessna wrote him back with a how-to manual. And so my grandfather contracted all of the necessary components. He he graded the uh the airfield and that airport is still in existence today in eastern Wake County North Carolina, and it sort of hits on what I wanna talk to you all about. Um there are obviously a lot of headwinds for the rural aviation industry. you know, cost is certainly a component, but it's not necessarily the cost of material and labor. It's the regulatory costs that come with the the delays, the permitting, the frivolous lawsuits, and it's a tragedy whenever a decades old or even older airport will close because they cannot maintain compliance b- because of the bureaucratic overhangs or the regulatory uh cost imposed with that. So Um, Mr. Doberson, I want to talk to you first, what are ways that we in Congress can streamline and can make it more economical to maintain existence as a rural airport? I'm talking about small rural airports.
You know, certainly efficiencies in the environmental process would be very beneficial. Um, working with our state agencies, the Department of Health in our state, our our local engineers who are experts in those environmental concerns,
Right.
You know, we all wanna be safe in the environment in everything that we do, uh, but certainly trying to expedite the environmental reviews for these important infrastructure projects that we're trying to complete in our airport and other airports across the state and in country uh would be vital for us.
And in regards to the the the I would say the challenges that you face currently to maintain your economic vitality, um, how would you order those in terms of the top three that Congress can help you with? what are the biggest challenges that you have?
Uh certainly funding uh i- is one uh to have available funding and as I said before, that's a federal, state and and local community in partnership. Um relief with those environmental regulations and and policies that we're trying to fight through with with the FAA and and other federal agencies would would be of benefit. And then also um just trying to provide extra funds for safety improvements at our airports and airports across the country. to make it safe not only for my employees that are out on the airfield but for those that are arriving departing on aircraft
and as to funding that you're talking about is it prime primarily from washington or you talking about private funding as well
it it could be a combination of both but but certainly at the federal level yeah i think it's most critical and our state has been very generous at our airports in in north dakota
yep
we're very fortunate in that regard in their investment through the legislature and aeronautics commission but but and also with the local community
sure Mister Collins, I wanna talk to you briefly, I see that that um your group has recommended an increase in the mandatory retirement age from sixty-five to sixty-seven. Do you know how that calculus was arrived at to go up to sixty-seven, as opposed to let's say seventy, seventy-two?
I'm not aware of us making that recommendation.
Are you aware of the statutory requirement? I could have misread it, I'm sorry.
I'm aware of the I'm aware of the requirement and you
Yes. Well, let me ask you then, uh, this angle. How are what are your thoughts about that requirement?
So, um, to this point there hasn't been a safety assessment, uh, beh- behind the requirement, so it might make sense to have an assessment to see if there are any safety effects of having the the age rate.
Do you think that that, um, private businesses, states, or other other bodies are incapable of, um, determining who could be a safe operator? of an airplane? I'm not trying to be hostile, I'm just curious. The sixty five, the sixty five age requirement just seems entirely arbitrary to me.
Mm-hmm.
I know pilots who have been forced to retire that are perfectly able to continue their career, and it's something that again, it's just a it's just a question at the top of my mind.
Yeah, I think it's worth researching whether or not it it makes sense and if there are any uh safety considerations behind that.
Okay. Mister Picard, do you have any any thoughts about that?
No, sorry, I'm sorry. We don't have a position on that.
Okay. In regards to the the remote towers, I do wanna continue that conversation.
Sure.
There are there are numerous airports in my district that are are waiting for tower approvals and to get the FAA on board with with expanding their footprint. And the tower piece is their last uh component. How can we expedite the use of these remote towers to the more up-and-coming airports.
I think lighting a fire under the FAA to move forward with these is the best way to do that. The technology has proven.
Yep.
I saw it in Liseberg where it worked great. Um, I know that they've got other contractors that they're looking at working with right now, different from who are different from the ones that were doing it before, but the tep- technology worked. Six years ago when I saw it, it can only have improved since then.
Yep. I mean, the the situation that I have is in is a a county called Johnson County, and they have one of the busiest airports in the state. The only thing they need is increased tower functionality. And they have the funding, they got
For a fraction of the cost of a regular tower.
Exactly. They just can't get the approval.
Yes, sir.
Thank you so much, Mr. Chairman. I'm over. I appreciate it.
All right. I now recognize Mr. Stanton.
Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, thank you to our witnesses for being here for this important hearing. For rural communities, reliable air service isn't a convenience, it's a central infrastructure in Arizona. Small airports support our robust tourism industry, as well as connecting residents to health care education and the broader national economy. Take, for example, Flagstaff, Pulliam Airport, the primary gateway for nearly half a million people in northern Arizona, a key gateway for visitors traveling to the Grand Canyon. Yet to spice strong demand, Flagstaff ranks amongst the most expensive airports in the contiguous United States. Passengers face fewer flight options, higher fares, They can't just choose a different airport. The next closest commercial airport is more than ninety while miles away, an hour and a half in a car. Flagstaff is seeking relief through the small community air service development program, applying for grants to expand connectivity to hubs like Denver and Salt Lake City. Mister Pecoraro,
Yep.
are there specific changes to the small community air service development program that we should be considering to improve air service in these communities, particularly those like Flagstaff, which have challenges in generating local
i don't have any specific recommendations today uh what i would say and what i've as i said earlier is that i think that what's critical is you know these programs have been in existence for a long time market conditions have changed economics have changed uh conditions on the ground have changed what we need to do is for the usdot nfa to sit down and develop a national strategy on how we're gonna retool all this working with all the stakeholders as they did recently with the uh national strategy on advanced air mobility, which is a terrific effort and uh you know is gonna yield real results and we think an approach like that would really help benefit these types of programs.
Thank you very much. Families in Arizona as they plan their summer travel, unfortunately the war in Iran and the closure of the Strait of Hormuz has sent jet fuel prices through the roof, doubling since the conflict began. That's show up showing up in ticket prices for travelers in Metro Phoenix and everywhere. And for many in rural communities, limited air service and fewer competitive options make those costs especially difficult to avoid. Miss Malarkey-Black, if higher fuel costs persist, do you anticipate airlines reducing service in certain markets? And if so, are smaller rural communities likely to feel those impacts more acutely than larger metropolitan areas?
The economics of small community routes make them uniquely vulnerable to cost
Thank you very much. Um, those are all my questions, so I yield back, Mr. Chairman.
General Wood yields. I now recognize Mr. Johnson.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman, uh, and ranking member, uh, for organizing this important hearing and thank you to the witnesses for your time and your testimony today. In a lot of small communities, missing a flight doesn't just change travel plans, it changes what people can reach and what opportunities reach them. That's because when the nearest major airport is hours away, air service becomes part of the community's lifeline. And right now, too many of these communities are watching that lifeline fray. Not because they don't matter, but because the economics of aviation don't always treat them like they do. That's exactly why Congress stepped in with the bipartisan twenty twenty four FAA reauthorization law. We protected the essential air service program, the small community air service development program, and airport improvement program funding because safety and infrastructure shouldn't depend on the size of your tax base. But a program on paper doesn't mean much if people can't feel it in their daily lives. If flights keep disappearing, if prices keep rising, if workforce shortages keep pushing service away, then we still have work to do. My hope is today, uh, that we make sure these programs are doing what Congress intended, keeping small and rural communities connected to opportunity, not cut off from it. Whether you live in a rural community or in a growing suburb of Metro Atlanta, you deserve to be connected. People just want a fair shot, and that's what they deserve. And that's really what this comes down to, making sure that folks in smaller communities aren't treated like an afterthought. These programs exist because Congress made a commitment, and commitments must mean something. I'm looking forward uh to um Hearing more from you all in response to uh my questions, I only have a limited amount of time however, Mister. I would characterize some goals of any small community as growing their demand, investing in their airport,
Mm-hmm.
and show they can sustain reliable service. Most folks would look at that and say that's success. But in your testimony you said some communities end up penalized for that success, when market conditions shift against them. Mister Park Park Pecoraro, can you further explain what it looks like when those market conditions turn, and does that kind of shift end up undoing the progress the community has worked so hard to build?
It certainly can, uh, and a great example of that is what happened to a lot of communities you know during and after the pandemic when when conditions shifted people worked from home, people traveled less, they weren't able to travel, um you know demand dropped significantly, airlines shut down service, you know pilot shortage uh was exacerbated, um and we saw a lot of communities lose service. And under the current rules of the EAS program there's there's no there's there's a, it's very difficult to get back in and use that program to rebuild a successful service that you once had prior to the pandemic. So one of the things that we're encouraging Congress to do is to look at, you know, you know, some kind of a path for some of those communities to get back in and be able to rebuild that service. And also note, along those lines that the Georgia DOT recently completed and used a a SCASD grant, very successfully focused on small community air service development, uh to fund marketing, social media campaigns, advertising, to try and build that type of service across a wide number of airports in Georgia. The results increased community awareness of local airports, and we saw a measurable rise in ticketed passengers at each of the participating airports. These programs do work when they're applied uh properly.
Thank you. Miss Black, you've made it clear in your testimony that what looks like low demand is often really the result of the system pulling back first with fewer departures, fewer destinations and schedules that no longer work for people. Miss Black, where should we begin to stop this pattern of the system pulling back first?
We have to start I think we have to start with two things at once. First is the fleet, making sure that we have the right size aircraft to serve smaller communities, and equally important, the workforce. We need to have the people to operate the fleets to connect these smaller communities through to the hubs and through them and beyond.
Thank you. I'm surprised I've got time to yield back, but I shall do so. Thank you.
Very well, Hank. Uh, I now recognize Mister McDowell.
Well, thank you, Chairman, and thank you to the witnesses for being here to testify before our subcommittee today. Uh, Mister Pecoraro, what would you say are the top two or three challenges that threaten small community air uh service?
Pilot shortage? phasing the the aging out of regional aircraft that are, you know, appropriately sized for those communities, um, and the rising cost of uh travel.
So you would say that the essential air service program is vital to rural air connectivity, correct?
Absolutely.
So prior to the Airline Deregulation Act of nineteen seventy eight, the US government managed the aviation industry, um, and the deregulation changed all of that and introduced an aviation based on the free market. Um I guess my question for you is why do you disagree with the criticisms of the EAS program?
I don't know that it's so much that I disagree with the criticisms of the program, it's just that I think that the program in in the forty, almost fifty years since it was created, hasn't really been been updated. And the airline industry has changed dramatically from what Congress thought it was going to be, when it was deregulated. And I think that that's why, you know, you know, uh that's why we need to take a hard look at, you know, what the program is accomplishing right now, and think about ways to reform it. I'm not saying, I I think, you know, support continues to be important, uh what that support looks like certainly can change. I think it's, you know, foolish to think that everything remains the same and you don't need to change things and and and modify them, but Yeah, I think that's where we are today, that we've allowed a certain complacency to exist where we haven't made those difficult changes.
Miss Black, how did airlines struggle to find pilots impact regional aviation more than the rest of the industry?
Regional airlines are the career entry point. Um, that's normal. You know, we we hire the pilots that are coming from the pipeline. Um, we were in an existing pilot shortage before the pandemic. And after the pandemic, when we demand sprang back so much faster than an- anybody anticipated. Our major airline partners hired voraciously and they find the best and brightest working for us. So um as a result we parked about a quarter of our fleet, um we didn't have the pilots to fly them, more specifically we didn't have the captains to fly them because when a major airline hires they take a captain and then we can pull a first officer from the pipeline, not only were there not enough first officers but we obviously needed to have um captains so Uh as a result, a quarter of the fleet was parked and small communities went into crisis. I mean it the the amount of air service that small communities lost was stunning and devastating.
So to that point, how does the loss of air connectivity materially hurt rural areas and economies?
Well if you think about it from a business perspective, you need to be able to get in and out reasonably. Um I go and visit small communities as part of my job, I speak at small community, air service uh associations at smaller uh states with smaller service and it takes a long time to get there um i go there because it's my job but if you're a recruiter if you're somebody that's trying to get parts if you're trying to see a sick loved one you need to have set uh schedules and departures and routes that meet your needs and when we lose the frequency and we lose the destination options then suddenly that's not as workable
so you you argue that declining departures from regional airports can be an imperfect measure to or i guess of consumer preference why is that
specifically the decline in seats you can have a increase in seats meaning you are actually uh able to to carry more passengers but in departures and the destination uh options are shrinking because you're moving to bigger airplanes they take more passengers at once but they necessarily have to go to fewer places and less often because of the way they're doing it
mister collins based on your work at the gao do you agree with the other witnesses' statements on the value of the essential air service program?
The essential air service program does provide a a valuable service in that it it gives a floor of service to that community.
So yes.
Correct.
All right, Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Gentlemen yields. Uh, uh, thank you so much, uh, any further questions from any members of subcommittee have not been recognized? I don't see any. Hey, this listen. I appreciate you all being here. This will conclude our hearing today. I thought you all did a hell of a job, great job. Uh, the sub All right, we'll get my my dentist friend out of Jersey. All right. Do you need thirty seconds to prepare, Mister Vendrew, or are you set? He's set.
I'm prepared.
All right, Mister Vendrew, you're ready.
Chairman, I'm sorry. I was running around in between committees and I apologize to all of you, but I'm glad I made it. Ah, let me get started. Thank you, Mister Chairman, for recognizing me. Um, as we discuss the future of our rural and small community air service, I wanted to highlight a provision in the Build America Two Fifty Act that will provide a real boost to regional airports and rural airports. I was happy to work with Representatives Rob Bresnahan and Chris Delusio on the Motor Coach Employment Pilot Program. You might be familiar with it. It ensures passengers who begin their trip on an airline-operated Motorcoach connection count as employments for an airport funding purposes. For example, in my airport, Atlantic City International, if you get on a bus there and you go to Philadelphia Airport, um that counts for Atlantic City, especially with critical funding. For many smaller and regional airports, passenger boarding numbers are critical. They help determine eligibility for federal funding. and support the infrastructure investments needed to maintain service. For airports facing service reductions or airline withdrawals, which we just went through recently, as you saw with Spirit Airlines, um, we've got good news though, we just met with Breeze and they're gonna fill in the gaps. Motor coach employments will help preserve access to national aviation systems. In my district, Atlantic City International Airport has faced significant challenges following the closure and reduction of service associated, as I mentioned, with spirit. Airports across the country are experiencing similar pressures as airlines consolidate service and focus operations on larb larger hubs. The Motor Coach Employment Pilot Program will help ensure that smaller communities remain connected, which is so important. And uh you saw Pete just speak about that a little while ago, and it's important for him, Pete Stabler, it's important for all of us that are in the regional areas, smaller areas, rural areas, for economic opportunity, for health care, for education, for tourism, and the broader transportation network. As you all know, and I thank you for your work. Ms. Black, thank you for being here today. Regional airlines continue to face pilot supply constraints and rising operating costs to what extent are those pressures still driving service reductions at smaller airports like all of ours, and what policy changes would be most effective to restoring service to underserved communities. Thank you.
Thank you for the question. Right now what we're seeing is that um we are seeing a slight increase in departures nationwide, um but it's mixed and you can it just shows that you can have good national numbers, while the individual communities like Lansing and many many others are still far far behind so it's not so much a question of if we're still cutting um we've moved up from the nadir of the pilot shortage in twenty twenty three and we are starting to rebuild but that recovery has not reached communities everywhere and we still have a long way to go before it does our non hubs and our non primary airports that serve the smallest rural communities are still down by an enormous amount we have a lot of work to do to make sure that the pilot pipeline can can catch up and the fleet is there so we can continue to reconnect those communities
yeah and it's a big issue and we're gonna fight with you shoulder to shoulder to do everything we can to connect these communities cuz it's a big deal and it's a big chunk
thank you
of america you know not everybody lives in philly new york state i i don't have to go through with you or atlanta mister doberstein thank you for being here today as well how will programs that better integrate airports with air carrier operated ground transportation help smaller airports retain relevance and maintain passenger volumes.
Well, it's critically important. Um, we were the recipient of landline service from Fargo to Minneapolis, Saint Paul, which is about a four hour bus ride. It was extremely successful, but then landline took our bus and moved it to Philadelphia for other opportunities there, I think through American Airlines, but it worked extremely well for us. The traveling public embraced it. Um, but I think the ground transportation is an opportunity for other rural communities to connect to the national transportation system.
I I think it is too, I think it really can help and it makes a difference, and it's relatively convenient. You know, it's still easier again, I'll just give my own parochial example, from if you if you have to go to Philly airport, I'd much rather go out of Atlantic City, but if you have to um it certainly, you just jump on the bus, everything's prepared, the baggage check, all that, and you go to Philly and you're done. But it's a much quicker and easier way to do it, so and that's throughout the country for these smaller airports.
Yes.
Mister Collins, last question. GAO has documented passenger leakage from smaller airports to larger hubs. In your vote, in your view, in your view, has Motor Coach employments shown promise in helping smaller communities compete and retain travelers? I know you know the answer, I know the answer, but I wanna hear it.
That's a definite yes. Um, in our work, stakeholders have told us that bus service is um a great opportunity to uh make sure that rural communities are connected to the nass. Now it may not fit every rural uh community, but it is uh an an option for many.
Thank you, and to the great chairman, who I am gonna miss a lot when he leaves us in the House of Representatives, uh I yield back to you,
Thank you, thank you, sir.
chairman, we appreciate you.
Thank you, sir. I now recognize Mister Shrive. Good to see you.
Mister Shriv should be happy that I showed up, right? He would have been done for.
That's correct.
Uh, well, I thank you. Uh, thank you, uh, uh, Chairman and, uh, Ranking Member. Uh, Mister Carson and I, uh, our fellow Hoosiers, uh, uh, I, uh, represent, uh, a part of Indianapolis, uh, that, uh, the airport ind is located in mr. Carson has a portion of it too i think i've got the better portion of ind it includes the uh uh fedex uh air cargo operations the second largest fedex air hub in the uh world uh and uh uh indiana is the home of republic airways uh it's uh headquartered uh uh there in the metro and of course uh folks here but uh some of my colleagues may not know that administrator uh uh uh b- b- brian's uh the very recent former ceo of republic airways uh and so he brings that subject matter expertise in uh you know the the regional uh feeder system uh to the table at uh both large airports and of course midsize and smaller ones that that are so important to the passenger infrastructure that we've got in this country. Um, I appreciate the opportunity to parachute back in. This is my third time in the room and and I appreciate our four witnesses' uh testimony and what you've shared with all of us today. Um, I don't wanna retrace ground that may well have been covered by my colleagues, um, but maybe tie it off if I could with just a just a c- a couple of couple of closing questions or for consideration that any of the any of the four of you might have. If we stay the course, um, from a funding standpoint, if we do nothing different over the next few years, what what what does essential air service into many of the smaller communities, uh, that folks like I re- represent, in Indiana, and I have dozens of public access airport communities like Mister Stauber passionately spoke to if we if we stayed the course funding level and otherwise what does the future look like from your four perspectives, your agency perspectives in particular uh Ms. Black or Mister Pecario?
Thank you for the question. I think our environment is not static and our response to the environment can't be either. whether that's air traffic control modernization bringing that to all airports of all sizes including the digital situational awareness tools they need uh the workforce um you mentioned republic they've got lift that's an incredible investment that the private sector is making in uh the future of our workforce but making sure that more people from working class backgrounds can afford it through accessible uh student loans that cover the full cost of flight training making sure that we encourage manufacturing of the fleet um that serve these smaller communities that's a big one and making sure when we bring safety to airports of all sizes that we do it in a way that works with the fleet um so that we can comply and we can continue to preserve those airports
if uh if we do nothing but leave the funding at the current levels which is much appreciated of course uh i think that you'll see communities to continue to see a decline in service because we won't be attacking the fundamental problems that they face right now. And so that's why we're here to urge Congress to develop the, you know, encourage the US DOT and the FAA to develop a strategy that can do a better job of providing access to the uh air system uh international system.
Is immigration away from the uh the the smaller regional jets, the the one thirty-fives, one forty-fives, primarily a function of insufficient numbers of pilots? That more than anything else? Anyway.
Just to make sure I understand your question, you're saying the migration away from one thirty-five airports?
Yeah, uh w- yeah, y- uh
Or excuse me, one thirty-five airlines at airports service?
Y- y- yeah, I th- uh Miss Blank, I think in your earlier testimony you noted that there were fewer fifty passenger jets in in service and uh I'm not sure if it if it that was from you, but is that a function of not enough trained crews, and so where you've got pilots you need to put them behind the stick or the yoke of larger regional jets. Is that's what is that what is driving that? Uh, at Purdue airport they just landed um flagged as United service, and they're operating uh those fifty seat uh aircraft. So they're still out there, but there are fewer and fewer of them.
There are fewer, it's a math question. Um, when you have a limited supply of pilots, the network carrier is trying to serve as many passengers at once and that typically deploying larger aircraft whether that's larger regionals or in some cases mainline but of course not all communities can support a seventy six seat jet let alone an aerobatic jet so we still need that fifty seat um fleet unfortunately that's the exact gap right now we've got some scope clause constraints with the that our labor union contracts with the major airlines that actually limit the manufacturing um of new regional jets because they limit what kind of jets we can deploy including the weight Um, so it's a complicated uh issue for us, but, but yes, that is, those are some of the many constraints that are facing the fifty seat market. And I will say, respect to Part one thirty-five carriers, they do have uh pilot issues because they are, you know, they, they are a source of great experience for pilots to come in, but they uh trip very quickly uh to larger regionals and then move on through the system.
I appreciate that. Uh, my time's uh expired, but I just want to clarify, I was referring to the Embraer one thirty-five, not the Part one thirty-five, with respect to the smaller aircraft. Uh, I appreciate the witnesses' uh testimony and uh, Mister Chairman, I appreciate the indulgence with the time. Thank you everyone.
Yes, sir. The gentleman yields. Are there any further questions from members of the subcommittee? Seeing none, this concludes our hearing today again, I wanna thank each and every one of you for being here. This subcommittee stands adjourned.
Right, it's free.
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