Department of the Air Force Fiscal Year 2027 Budget Request for Seapower and Projection Forces

Good afternoon. I'd like to thank the witnesses for being here today at today's hearing as we discuss the Air Force's fiscal year twenty twenty seven budget request. I look forward to hearing how this budget will get at the challenges of our increasingly complex security environment. I want to start by acknowledging the brave servicemen and women who are serving so honorably overseas to make the world a safer place for us all. I speak for everyone when I say that our thoughts and prayers are with them. One of my most important responsibilities as Chairman of this subcommittee is ensuring that our airmen have the resources, training, and capabilities that maintain and grow our edge over our adversaries. Today's discussion of fleet modernization, strategic deterrence, and emerging technologies will inform our work towards that goal as we head into the heart of this year's NDAA cycle. I also want to thank President Trump for his year, this year's historic budget request, which will not only get our servicemen and women the tools they need to succeed, but also boost the ongoing revitalization of our defense industrial base. I want to focus uh today's hearing on the role of the bomber and mobility platforms that help us overcome the tyranny of distance and project American power across the furthest reaches of the globe. Our bomber fleet is the cornerstone of our strategic deterrent. And our mobility platforms are the backbone of our operational effectiveness, allowing us to move personnel, equipment, and supplies around the world with unmatched efficiency. In today's constantly evolving threat environment, our adversaries are investing heavily in advanced capabilities as they try to ch- close in on our lead. It is critical that we ensure that never happens. I look forward to hearing from our distinguished witnesses as we work to find solutions to ensure that our Air Force remains the best in the world. Now I'd like to turn it over to my good friend, Ranking Member Joe Courtney, for any opening remarks that he may have. Thank you and Mister Courtney.

Thank you uh Mister Mister Chairman and thank you to the witnesses uh for being here today. Um again I have written remarks I'm gonna um just really summarize quick so cuz I know we wanna get into the testimony and questions. Um you know sometimes people think that this subcommittee uh only does um ships and and things that float and uh uh the fact is, part of our portfolio is the airlift um uh work that we're gonna be discussing here today and again there there's just so many um critical platforms many of which are starting to get a little long in the tooth that you know i think is uh really um requires our urgent uh attention uh whether again it's uh i think yeah the average age of the fleet is about sixty four years in terms of the you know some of the uh uh tanker uh fleet that's out there right now and um b fifty twos you know we got a obviously a a b twenty one uh program that's now you know gonna be recapitalizing uh the bombers which uh uh trent mentioned and and so that's obviously um again one of these uh programs that you know we have to just go bigger faster and and you know make sure that we hit the requirements that are out there i also wanna talk about the v c ask ask some questions about the v c twenty five b program which there is high public interest And we've had, this has been an ongoing topic um in this subcommittee, not just over the last two years, but frankly going back to twenty uh seventeen. Um so um again, really appreciate you know the professional witnesses that we have here today. As I said I'll uh ask my written remarks be entered for the record and yield back.

Without objection. And and Mister Courtney, I think I got some things out of order. The subcommittee will now come to order. I ask unanimous consent that the chair be authorized to declare recess at any time. Without objection, so ordered. With us today we have Mister William Bailey, the Assistant Secretary of the Air Force for Acquisition, Technology and Logistics, and Lieutenant General Dave Tabor, the Deputy Chief of Staff for Plans and Programs. Mister Bailey, since this is your first time in front of this committee, welcome. General Tabor, you are a frequent visit, so welcome back. I believe the witnesses have a joint statement prepared for us today, so you are recognized for five minutes for any opening remarks that you'd like to make.

Yeah, Chairman Kelly, Ranking Member Courtney, and the distinguished members of the subcommittee. Thank you for having us here today to provide testimony on the Department of the Air Force's projection forces aviation programs and capabilities. The FY twenty-seven budget requestor bolsters critical modernization efforts, such as the development of the future bomber fleet and the B-twenty-one, continuation of uninterrupted tanker recapitalization with KC forty-six pro- program extension, and recapitalization of our strategic airlift capabilities through the next-gen airlift program. I wanna highlight on the KC forty-six program for the moment. From Operation Absolute Resolve to Operation Epic Fury, the KC forty-six has been in the fight for over the last several months, and has proven to be a critical enabler to the joint operations therein. Though it is performing admirably, the fleet still faces readiness challenges requiring daily heroics from the crews on the ground. To address those challenges, the Department of War and the Air Force have deliberately prioritized readiness initiatives within the FY twenty-seven President's budget. Those efforts initiate reliability improvements, additional sparing, and other supportability projects. In parallel, the Air Force and Boeing have embarked on a KC-forty-six Readiness Improvement Initiative, which repurposes five early-built aircraft for near-term readiness improvements. It streamlines and accelerates retrofits for two of the remaining Cat-one deficiencies and puts focused effort into the fleet's primary readiness detractors. The combination of these two initiatives is expected to provide a near-term availability boost of approximately six percent, and provide a long-term aircraft availability increase of over twenty percent by twenty-thirty. The Air Force is moving rapidly to implement the Secretary of War's acquisition transformation imperatives. We appreciate the authorities' provided by Congress and the FY twenty-six NDA A, and continued partnership as we work to transform acquisition into a true war fighting function. Our focus uh is on mission outcomes, with a guiding principle of ensuring every portfolio acquisition executive or PAE, has the three things they need to succeed, the authority, the talent and the resources. The Air Force is taking a phased approach on PAEs with the initial rollout of five portfolios that represent a cross-section of our most critical mission areas to pioneer and mature this new framework. And we're already seeing successes. We examined over two hundred contracting authorities to identify areas for delegation. As a result, eighty-five percent of unrestricted contracting authorities have been delegated to the PAE level. And a hundred percent of the business and contract clearance authority now sit with the PAE. Translating to real world real world impacts, The PAE for propulsion is currently developing a sixteen billion dollar, multiple award IDIQ contract that engages over fifty companies across the industrial base to rapidly solve operational and technological challenges. Because of that increased delegated authority, empowering the PAE to execute a contract ceiling that uh far exceeds historical thresholds, the team has already reduced the time required to compete and award the contract by forty percent. Now more than ever, the acquisition enterprise requires a highly specialized and agile workforce. We're working to ensure PAEs have the workforce they need to translate significant budget investments into capabilities. Due to recent DOW policy changes on manpower and the use of hiring authorities, PAE Weapons was able to bypass traditional and protracted hiring constraints to successfully onboard sixty-nine critical acquisition professionals, just in the last month. Furthermore, these authorities have enabled our team to maintain a robust and a- agile talent pipeline. We are currently processing active personnel actions. We're executing rapid manpower realignments and utilizing targeted incentive package packages at a speed not seen before. We are examining ways to empower PAEs with the ability to make active trade-offs between acquisition risk and operational risk. Reforms to the resourcing process include a realignment of and reduction in budget line items. are critical to enable those trade-offs. We will continue to work with Congress to ensure resourcing flexibilities are aligned with the aprop- appropriate transparency and oversight. Thank you again for the opportunity to testify. We look forward to working with the Congress, industry, and the communities that support us to ensure we maintain the necessary military advantage to secure our vital national interests and to support our allies and partners. Thank you for your steadfast support and partnership as we deliver needed capabilities for the Air Force. Thank you.

I now recognize myself, five minutes for questions. Uh Mister Bailey, I think your call sign is Elvis. So the first question is, do you know whose district Elvis was born in and what town?

I'd like to take that one for the record, sir.

Well, I'll give you the answer, it's my district and it's Tupelo, Mississippi. So thank you. Uh Mister Bailey, the fiscal year twenty-seven budget request, for an advanced tanker systems program building on the work of the next generation air refueling system. Can you explore uh explain the differences between these two programs?

Yes, sir. Uh, as we were as we were looking at um the work done uh in studying on that next uh generation of advanced systems, we did come to the conclusion that there is a greater need for us to take a look at what are those no regret bets to place on uh aircraft survivability uh when it comes to large aircraft and large aircraft protection because we will have we will have tankers going forward but we currently have hundreds of tankers, we have we have hundreds and hundreds of airlifters that also face those same style of threats. Uh so what you're seeing in that ATS program uh is a aircraft agnostic approach to survivability. And y- and as we take a look

And General Tabor, the recent KC one thirty five crash is a stark reminder of the risk our airmen face daily. Could you please detail for us the current state of connectivity and situational awareness capabilities of the KC one thirty five fleet.

Yes, uh thank you, Chairman. Um, so, uh, kind of dovetailing on what uh, Mister Bailey talked about, I mean, the A ATS, we really are focused on uh, connectivity across our entire fleet. Uh, right now we have about uh, a hundred and five million dollars uh, programmed and twenty-seven about one point one billion across the FIDA to uh field about three hundred and fifteen hybrid SATCOM terminals, and an additional two hundred and forty or so KU uh radar or uh KU uh array kits uh for the KC uh one thirty-five fleet. Uh there's also been uh similar capabilities being uh installed on the uh KC forty-sixes. Uh f- specific to uh KC one thirty-five, uh we have a vast majority of those uh connected now with uh link sixteen, as well as the uh tactical uh data relays uh through the uh Arctic program. Uh we also have uh funding for uh Star Shield and uh ATOMs, it's a airlift tanker open mission system uh that will be uh uh added on here, well it's in the process of being uh added on to the KC one thirty five fleet to be complete over the course of the next about four years. Uh and then that uh the hybrid SATCOM will kind of uh lay in on top of that. Uh so really over the course of about uh the next six years you'll see the uh full fleet of uh KC one thirty-fives uh fully uh connected.

I thank you and I now yield the balance of my time and I recognize Mister Courtney.

Thank you uh Mister Chairman um uh Mister Bailey as I indicated um you know the Air Force one program is definitely uh as I said um something that this subcommittee has um been tracking and overseeing for a number of years. So um uh a year ago uh Darlene Costello, your predecessor, testified before committee and kinda walked us through the delivery time for the uh new two Air Force one uh cohort that uh again was purchased from Boeing uh back in I I believe it was twenty seventeen it was or maybe twenty eighteen. Again, her testimony was that twenty twenty eight was uh sort of the new kind of target for uh delivery of those um and then obviously the um the new plane uh that was purchased from Qatar um is obviously was a another topic that we uh discussed so the the press reports are that the Qatar plane which was just purchased about a year ago is gonna be uh delivered sometime in on on in July of twenty twenty six is that true uh how much did that work or how much did the retrofit of that plane cost and And where are we with the the real fleet that, you know, we uh started that journey uh as I said almost uh ten years ago?

Yes sir, thank you for the question. Uh when it comes to the uh the bridge aircraft, our current expectation is that uh the aircraft modification will be less than four hundred million dollars. Uh when we talk about um the VC twenty five B and the schedule there, uh right now the program is making good progress. um we've had a chance to go through and work closely with the stakeholders as well as Boeing itself to get through uh some key aspects of the design. Uh we were able to close out a lot of those design questions in October of last year uh the just a couple of months ago we were able to settle the questions on airworthiness certification and now we're in the process of generating those those uh um uh airworthiness uh certification uh articles. So we do believe at that point we are still on track with the previous schedule in terms of having it ready in twenty twenty eight.

Thank you. I again, it's still kind of uh well, I guess the question is if a a plane that was purchased about a year ago was retrofit, is being delivered in twenty twenty six for the president of United States to, you know, fly in. Um and we're still waiting for the two other planes which um have been going through, you know, extensive retrofit as well. What what's the difference here? Why was one so much faster and cheaper? Is it is it not gonna be really the same capability? Is that why it's a different uh production schedule? Um again, you know, as I said, we've been working on this for a long time and it just something seems a little out of sync.

Y- yes sir, it's it's uh uh difficult to get into the specifics on the requirements in this kind of forum. Um I I do think a as we look at um this and you'll you'll hear it in many different areas too, where we spend a lot of time getting very focused in on the user and the requirements and what the opportunity is. We look at opportunities where you'd say, hey if we take a look at a schedule, you know, does the schedule actually benefit you, where you'd be willing to make trades on on minor requirements, certainly not making trades on major requirements. Uh and and you're seeing the by-product of a lot of that work, a lot of very focused work on what's the operational need. Uh but again we can come back to you and talk to you in more detail in a classified form.

I mean I think we deserve that honestly cuz the just the disparity in terms of the costs and the disparity in terms of schedule kind of screams out for um some answers in terms of just trying to make sure that the aircraft is gonna be able capable of doing what it's supposed to do um and it again just from a sort of intuitive standpoint it just seems like it it something is different between these um in in this program that um we really need to understand better um you know what that difference is. Uh with the rest of my time I just wanna turn to General Tabor for a second to talk about the next generation airlift. I mean the C one thirties, seventies and fives fly approximately eighty eight hundred to nine hundred mobility sorties a day, and it's getting old. Um can you talk uh again about what the Air Force next generation airlift efforts to uh keep those that you know capability uh functioning?

Yes sir, this is a uh uh highly important to us. Uh I'd tell you right up front the good news is that we don't have any immediate concerns about the viability of any of our airlift fleet. However, acknowledging that uh the Cseventeen's and Cfive's particularly uh continue to get uh older, we know that they will need to be recapitalized here sooner than later. So in the twenty-seven uh budget we have uh earmarked, actually pulled forward uh funding for an analysis of alternatives to kind of look at what the characteristics of a future uh airlift platform might be. Uh, so we think we've uh, we're we're getting ahead of it. Uh, it's it's not something that we need to act on immediately, but we certainly need to uh uh be thinking about it so we can act on it before it becomes an emergency.

I'll let you use some of my time so your time didn't expire. Uh, I now recognize Doctor Desjardins.

Thank you, Chairman. Thank our uh, to our witnesses, and uh Uh channeling my inner Joe Wilson, I'm gonna say that my son Ryan just got certified on the C one thirty, so I'll pass along that to to him and but he was uh Naval Academy, went through TBS, so he's flies for the Marines. But anyway, uh that'll be good news that uh better equipment's coming his way. Mister Bailey, I noticed that you spend some time at Arnold Air Force Base in my district, and uh I know you understand how important our T our RDT and E uh funding is to ensure we stay ahead of our adversaries. I'd like to take this opportunity to encourage the continued and increased investment in our test infrastructure and the amazing work that comes out of the Air Force test community and our little Air Force base so uh how can Congress and the department continue to work together to increase the flexibility for construction development acquisition within our test infrastructure?

Yeah, thank you, sir, and that was uh that was a special time. That is a that is a pretty amazing base with a great mission. Uh When I think about, when I think about those style of challenges, um uh you know Congress has sub- has supported additional flexibility on a lot of the construction activity which I think has been put to, to good use. Uh when I think more towards the future it is probably in areas where we see limitations on our ability to test weapon systems um that are now consuming larger ranges um, greater pieces out of the electromagnetic spectrum. So if we - if we could work together on issues like NEPA or even areas like spectrum access, uh, even if it is to give us opportunities to, um, uh, to assert some priority while we're doing critical testing, I think that'll - that'll be helpful to us.

Uh, moving on to drones, uh, you know, they're pr- proven difficult to defeat, by costing a fraction of the interceptors that are required to stop them. Uh, fixed ground radar cannot reliably detect persistent low altitude Shaheed drones. Uh, what is the department the department doing in FY twenty-seven requests to prioritize counter drone defense, including airborne early warning platforms and legacy close-in weapon systems that can address drone threats without consuming high-end interceptors needed for ballistic missile defense?

Yes sir, the, eh, we are working, uh the Air Force is working closely with the the joint task force four O one on in their mission uh counter drone mission uh as well as as well as supporting the work being done as part of Golden Dome uh for some of those more advanced threats uh I could tell you from working closely with that team, uh the Air Force's view has always been around the need the the need to focus in on command and control. and very specifically open architectures inside that command and control. We will see, as you noted, the the threat will pivot and it'll pivot quickly. So your choice of sensors or sensing will need

Mm.

to keep pace with what that threat is doing. And then also you mentioned effectors. Uh, you know, shooting a a a million dollar weapon at a a four thousand dollar drone does not make sense. So you'll need to be able to to be agile there and keep pace with the threat. So again, sir, we work closely with that - that, uh, GIADA four O one, a- and for our part, whether it's changes in the sensors or changes in the effectors, you're always gonna want - you're always gonna want some stability in your command and control.

Yes, sir. And with all due respect from our - to our Chairman from Tupelo, Mississippi, who may not agree with the, uh, KC forty-six tanker placement, uh, I've gotta We're proud of our Tennessee, uh, Air National Guard members who will be s- receiving the K forty-six. tanker at McGee-Tyson Air National Guard Base in Knoxville, uh Tennessee. Are you expecting the cost and scheduled delays to the KC-forty-six program to impact when units can expect a new platform to arrive and either one's welcome to take that.

Uh, I'll take that. Uh, n- the the short answer is no. We don't anticipate any kind of uh delays uh at this point. I think uh currently programmed uh for those aircraft to begin arriving in F Y thirty-one. Uh so barring anything happening between now and then, uh we should be on that path.

Okay, but d- did you have anything to add um, Mr. Bailey?

Uh no, uh General Tabor has that time line down.

Okay, well the Chairman has Elvis and we have the KC forty-six, so we're all good. I yield back.

I'll just note that the refueling was created in Keyfield by the Key brothers in Meridian, Mississippi, where's where those KC forty-sixes should be, but That being said, I now recognize Mister Norcross.

Is that above or below the Mason-Dixon line?

Way below.

Three point nine, below. So, um thank you for the uh witnesses here today. Just wanna follow up on the uh CV twenty five program. Uh the original cost projections, original, not ten years ago, is three point five billion, Mister Bailey, do you have a figure on the current program?

No, no I d- I don't at the moment.

Well it was reported back then three. So, the point of making each of the ones that are being retrofitted or new are about a billion and a half plus. And we are years into it. So the idea from the one that was gifted to our country from Qatari of taking four hundred million and trying to understand the difference between our existing fleet and the Qatari there's a difference. Is that correct? Operationally?

So, I'd have to say in like in terms of overall performance, it should be similar in performance.

Not performance, in its operations, its mission. Do they both, the Qatari and our existing two,

To, to my uh, to my uh,

have the same capabilities?

to my understanding, sir, well, a- actually, sir, we have a hard time having this conversation without the

I, b- yeah, we're wiggling down the road, we're not gonna cross that line.

I got it. Uh, I, I'd say like in terms of its ability to transport, i- it's the same airframe.

Well that's pretty vague. So, for what we're gonna pay a million, a billion and a half each, We just got one given to us that cost us four hundred million. You see the math doesn't really add up and we're not trying to put you in a position to say what it is

Mm-hmm.

but they aren't the same capabilities to do what it has to do. Can the Qatar what are you calling the Qatari plane? What are you calling that?

I've heard it as a bridge aircraft, sir.

The bridge aircraft, let's make sure I put that. Will that be part of the mission to fly outside the continental United States?

I'm not clear on that. Um, I'm not clear on that, sir.

The new Qatari, the bridge, will that be cleared? Will the president be able to fly that outside of the borders of the continental United States?

I'll hafta I'll hafta take that, I'll hafta take that f- uh for record, sir.

All right. This is getting more difficult than I thought. Let's switch over to something a little bit more pleasant, the KC forty-six. We've gone through a long and difficult highway but from what I'm hearing uh we are on the right path. So general Midnight Hammer some of the uh capabilities of the KC forty-six, were there any issues during Midnight Hammer or the present conflict that's going on with KC forty-six and its ability to do a submission?

Not to my knowledge, Congressman.

OK. Um and I assume that none of those have the the new uh the vision system, I should know this, the

RVS.

uh yeah, the RVS two point O.

The RVS.

They do have them?

They do not have RVS two point O.

OK, so they're operating as they came out.

That's correct.

And we expect the first ones with the uh new system to be delivered when?

So, RVS uh two point O, the uh production uh cut-in uh will occur in uh the second quarter of uh FY twenty eight.

OK.

Uh and so that that's for the production aircraft.

Sure.

There'll be some uh uh retro fitting uh that begins uh prior to that.

So when do we expect the first, whether it's a retro or coming off the line, the new visual system to be operational in the first plane?

Uh so on track to uh start delivering early summer of twenty seven.

Great.

So about a year from now.

So I'll just wrap this up. Even though it had some very serious issues, we're seeing it operate in a way that has not been detrimental to our fleet or our fliers. Is that correct?

That's absolutely correct.

Good. I think that's important to to know, given where we came from. And with that I'll yield back balance of my time.

Uh, thank you, Mr. Norcross. I now recognize Doctor Jackson.

Thank you, Mister Chairman, and uh thank you uh, Mister Tyboar and uh General for being here today. Appreciate Um, in our increasingly complex global environment, the Air Force remains the cornerstone of our ability to project power globally. Uh, as the proud representative for Texas's thirteenth congressional district, home to the incredible airmen at Shepherd Air Force Base, I've seen firsthand the dedication and investment required to maintain that edge every single day. As we ask our fleet to fly longer and further than ever before, I look forward to hearing how the Air Force's twenty twenty seven budget request, which rightly seeks a twenty six percent increase in funding, will provide the investment necessary to support readiness at all levels, from next generation platforms and fleet modernization to training, maintenance and sustainment. Shepherd Air Force Base in my district is home to the eighty-second training wing, which is responsible for training the maintainers who keep our fleet in the air. As the Air Force undertakes a generational modernization of its boomer, or of uh sorry, of its bomber, mobility and special mission aircraft uh fleets, our maintenance training must evolve as well. General, and Mister Bailey both. What steps are being taken to invest the modernization to invest in the modernization of technical training? How are we ensuring that the training our maintainers receive today prepares them for the platforms and systems they will encounter on the flight line in the future?

Uh, Doctor Jackson, thank you for that question, uh so we're uh undertaking uh uh quite a number of things to the tune of about sixty million dollars a year at uh Shepherd. That includes uh classroom modernization uh which uh is uh IT infrastructure, uh it's uh digitizing the uh the current course ware, uh augmented and uh virtual uh reality devices uh for students, uh connectivity uh throughout the uh dorms, uh so it's really kind of uh I think uh changed fundamentally from the way that we have done things in the uh past there.

Thank you, and uh you know also uh I would say that uh we we we've had some conversations in the past and uh talking about uh the uh uh the ability for the uh the places like Shepherd Air Force Base to uh acquire a little bit more for the students that they have as far as their funding, not getting full uh credit to maintain their facilities based on the number of bodies that they actually have on base on their day-to-day. So I'm we're uh gonna address that as well. Sir? Anything to add?

Uh no, sorry. We we've looked at other ways to modernize the materials that those trainers are using through commercial sor- solution offerings. Uh, and we expect to extend that to the maintenance community as well.

Thank you, I appreciate it. Um, one more question. Uh, General, uh, recently had a great uh visit down to Air Force Special Operations Command headquarters in Herbert Field where uh I had the opportunity to see the Air Force Special Operations fleet and witness the evolving missions the command is undertaking uh as the chairman of the subcommittee on intelligence and special operations it's especially encouraging to have a leader with your background having commanded at the squadron group group and wing levels within the Air Force Special Operations Command as well as most recently as the Commander of Special Operations Command Europe. Given your experience in our Special Operations Forces, uh fleet across a slate of critical soft commands, what's your assessment of the Air Force's sustainment of the Air Force Special Operations fleet? Are we providing enough support to keep these specialized platforms ready for the increased operational tempo, that they face today and will face in the future?

Yes sir, we certainly are. Uh, some of the numbers uh here just uh recently. MC one thirty uh rates uh currently at about a eighty percent. Uh AC one thirty's uh just over a seventy-two percent. That's uh about anywhere from a ten to fifteen percent higher than uh the rest of the uh fleet. So uh they have the benefit of a little bit smaller fleet uh and so I think they get a little bit more uh touch time perhaps than uh the rest of uh the uh the air force. Fleet does, so they seem to be doing uh much better. That said, there are investments that we are uh currently making uh specifically in uh mission computers uh for the uh C-one-thirty uh fleet and that's Air Force wide, uh but the uh AFSOC aircraft are being prioritized for that. And then on the uh V-twenty-twos, which I know you're also uh very interested in, the uh vector, the enhanced cockpit technology replacement, that's also something that uh we have funded uh here recently. to the tune of about two hundred million dollars over the uh FIDEP. So my my assessment is that they're doing extraordinarily well in uh AFSOC right now.

Thank you, and you know I've been working with the uh SOCOM community, with SOCOM commander uh and you know uh pushing for the fact that I don't think that the SOCOM budget in general is where it's supposed to be. It should be much higher than it is right now. I mean it's not really keeping up with inflation even it's been flat for a long time. And that translates into the Air Force uh s special operations uh community as well. So uh keep that in mind. I think uh we we need to uh provide uh the Air Force Special Operations command with uh a little bit more in the process so that we make sure that we're not uh you know basically taking away from those that are that literally are on the tip of the spear. Thank you, I yield back.

Gentleman yields back, now recognized, Mister Binman.

Thank you, Chairman, thank you, gentlemen, for testifying today. So, Mister Bailey, given the vulnerability of current tanker aircraft in contested airspace, what is the Air Force's timeline for fielding survivability and connectivity upgrades to the advanced tanker system and are those uh funding levels sufficient?

Yes sir, thank you for the question. There are a couple of components that we consider uh i- in how do we improve the survivability. We talked a little bit earlier about uh uh how we're putting satellite communications and beyond line of sight communications into that fleet, uh the tanker fleet. Uh it's going into one thirty-fives as well as C forty-sixes as well as C seventeen's as well as C one thirties. Uh that situational awareness has has already yielded benefits uh i- in the one thirty-five community as they were able they were able very recently to to get situational awareness and turn around an abort out of a high threat area. So we've seen and and Air Mobility Command's been very clear with us on the real value of of that situational awareness that the beyond line of sight comms can yield. What we're looking at now is uh is now when we talk about the rest of what goes into uh survivability. And now we're talking about sensing and we're talking about countermeasure uh development as well. Uh we're shifting now from uh a lot of the um surface to air kinds of concerns like we did with laercum program and now looking at what happens uh at the water line and above as we're looking at threats coming down below uh so there is work that is that can be transitioning uh within We have investments that are in place both for uh both for the communications programs, as well as that sensor and countermeasure uh countermeasure activity.

Yeah, so just to um dive a little deeper into that one. Obviously we've seen um for for base defense issues, the challenges that unmanned systems um uh create and um the spider web operation in in Russia, Ukraine but also in uh in our current Middle East conflict so is w- part of that component is that also like on the ground component uh counter UAS are there investments in that?

Yes sir, as as as we work with as we work with the the the GIADA four O one crowd uh we look at we look at um ground-based sensing uh active systems, passive systems there um and how do they network together based on a particular location. This is an area where geography matters, the base layout matters, um and so you you know what's our opportunity to tailor that base by base, uh combine that with command and control as well as in the end effectors that'll allow us to go and engage those those that range of threats.

General, anything to add on that one?

I I would just add that uh you know this is a a very busy space right now for all the reasons that you highlight. and uh we really are looking at it in kind of a layered uh perspective. Obviously here in the continental United States, Golden Dome uh becomes a piece of that, not uh everything, but a piece of that. And then as you neck it down, I mean we have the Xtent uh systems that we have, our uh uh counter small UAS detection uh system. Uh and to Mister Bailey's point, you know what what we can do from an effector perspective in the CONUS is much different than what we can do overseas. Uh, and so we're trying to uh round that out. And that's where GIADA four O one and the work of the uh the dog comes in, in developing new capabilities perhaps that we can use here uh in the the United States. But uh again reinforcing uh Mister Bailey's point, we're we're really focused on how do we internalize this and make it something that is much more permanent uh that we can continue to develop because it's sorely needed.

So um, on the unmanned system side, and I've got about a minute left here, but can you talk about the investments that the Air Force is making in the unmanned systems? I mean, the other services are are looking at the defensive component and the offensive component. Um, can you talk about what investments uh the Air Force is making in offensive unmanned systems?

Y- yeah, well, so I would I'd be happy to give you the uh precise details on how much we have in the the SUADs uh for the uh record. What I'll tell you is that uh with the stand up of GIADA four O one, a sizeable chunk of that money from OSW went to that organization to do this development on behalf of the uh the services and then we'll reach in there to uh to pull those things out, but I don't have the precise number uh for how much they add. I'm happy to provide that though.

Thank you, uh you're back.

Now recognized former chairman of this uh subcommittee, Mister Whitman.

Well thank you, Mr. Chairman, I'd like to thank our witnesses for joining us today. Uh, General Tabor, I wanna start out with you, but I do wanna uh reach back into some history. It's been about ten years ago where uh Mr. Bailey and I and at the time Colonel White uh visited Palmdale to the Northrop Grumman facility there when the B-twenty-one was in its infancy and they were spinning up workforce and we were talking about all the things that were going on as the Air Force RCO And Northrop Grumman were working hand in hand, shoulder in shoulder, and the initial uh elements of putting the aircraft manufacturing scheme together, also testing the aircraft, looking at the things that we would do. And uh the the thing that I remember most vividly from that was the the projection that we were gonna go from a clean sheet paper design to a digital design. And Colby's skeptical. I thought, gosh, how are you how are you gonna do that, how are you gonna get the workforce to do that? And I was a hundred percent wrong. That was a great success story in how to uh execute one of the most complex aircraft ever manufactured in human history and here we are today with that aircraft. But I also wanna go back historically and talk about the assumptions that were made about that aircraft and what capability it would provide to the United States ten years ago and where we are today in looking at what that aircraft can do in a highly contested environment. where it's gonna be key to have just that sorta capability, a capability that the Chinese do not have, a capability that we are going to need uh in instances where there is a a large scale threat to the United States.

Mm-hmm.

So my question is is the analysis at the time was that we needed about one hundred of those aircraft. I would ask you today, based on what you know and the threat scenario today and what that aircraft brings to the table as far as capability, to be able to operate in a highly contested environment in ways that provide significant challenges for the Chinese to counter is that one hundred aircraft estimate that originated over ten years ago is that assumption the same today should we be satisfied with a hundred aircraft should that number be different higher lower uh give us your your assessment about where we are today versus where we were ten years ago with the assumptions about how many aircraft we need.

So that's a great topic and uh one that's being hotly debated in a lot of different corners right now. I'll tell you that the uh the Air Force position is that we need at least one hundred B-twenty-ones, uh acknowledging that there are a lot of voices that would say that some say as many as four hundred, three hundred, two hundred. Uh my sense is that we do need more than one hundred. What I can't tell you is the precise number. that it uh needs to be. But for all the excellent reasons that you pointed out, I mean uh a hundred is is the program of record that we uh stuck with. We're in the process of uh sharpening our pencils, really getting down to exactly what that is. And I think here in the next uh uh year by the time we get to the uh twenty-eight uh budget we'll be able to uh give you a better answer, a much more precise answer, and show you our homework.

Yeah. Now listen, I would encourage you, especially as the threat dynamic changes there, to to give us a more up to date number cuz I think the capability that aircraft provides is pretty amazing and I think it dovetails exactly in as we see the threat and the things that we need to to be able to to perform in that environment. Mister Bailey, good to see you. I know that uh through the years we've had a chance to cross paths multiple times. I appreciate all the great work that you've done for the Air Force through the years. I wanted to to get your perspective on the KC forty-six program. And obviously that's another key. As we look at uh operations like uh Operation Midnight Hammer, we had an opportunity to talk to the pilots there and the missions that they flew and and how they had to fly those missions and how refueling was a critical part of that and how we have a fleet of aging aircraft we saw unfortunately with a KC one thirty-five, a crash that occurred there. Uh, The challenge is for us is how do we make sure that we have not just a fleet of newer aircraft for a whole variety of reasons, but then how do we make sure that we sustain that fleet? You know, the challenges with the old KC-one thirty-fives is even with service life extensions and the things we have when you have an, an aircraft that is no longer going through a hot production line, uh, sustainment becomes a challenge because you just don't have the spare parts, and then you're into one-off production, which is prohibitively expensive. and also takes down your your your readiness for those aircraft, the numbers that are ready to fly, takes that down to a low level. Give me your perspective on how we can best look at sustainment model, a different sustainment model for KC forty six A.