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Senate · Hearing transcript

Hearings to examine worldwide threats; to be immediately followed by a closed session in SH-219.

Wednesday, March 18, 2026

Summary

  • Tulsi Gabbard (Director of National Intelligence, Office of the Director of National Intelligence) said Iran's regime remains intact but degraded after Operation Epic Fury strikes.
  • Kash Patel (Director, Federal Bureau of Investigation) said FBI stopped four December terrorist plots across California, Texas, North Carolina and Pennsylvania.
  • Sen. Warner (D-VA) pressed Gabbard on her presence at the Fulton County ballot seizure and missing foreign-threat briefings before midterms.
  • Sen. Collins (R-ME) focused on ISIS and counterterrorism gaps while Sen. Warner (D-VA) condemned FBI purges and election-security failures under Trump administration.
  • Tom Cotton urged clean FISA Section 702 reauthorization and supplemental intelligence funding ahead of closed session on Iran operations and Ukraine support.

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Hearing Details

Witnesses

Members Who Spoke

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Transcript

Sen. Cotton (AR)19:45 – 25:06

Annual Worldwide Threat Assessment hearing. Let me begin by welcoming our esteemed panel of witnesses, the Director of National Intelligence, Tulsi Gabbard, the CIA Director, John Ratcliffe, the FBI Director, Kash Patel, the Acting Director of the National Security Agency and Commander of US Cyber Command Lieutenant General William Hartman, and the DIA Director, Lieutenant General James Adams. Thank you all for your appearance today and for your service. I also want to offer a special thanks to General Hartman, who is about to enter a well-earned and well-deserved retirement. General, on behalf of the committee, thank you for your lifetime of service to our nation. I'd first like to take this opportunity to commend the thousands of men and women in our intelligence agencies whom our witnesses represent. Our intelligent profe- professionals are second to none. Because of their service, their dedication and their sacrifice, Americans are safer at home and around the world. But because of the nature of their work, grateful Americans don't buy their lunch at restaurants or even have a chance to say thank you. So on their behalf, let me simply say thank you. I wanna make two basic points this morning. First, the world is always a dangerous place, especially for America. But thanks to your agencies and President Trump's leadership, the world isn't quite as dangerous for Americans as it was a year ago. Thanks to the efforts of our military and intelligence personnel, including my fellow Arkansans who are now serving in the Middle East, the Iranian revolutionary regime that terrorized the world for forty-seven years, is finally knocked on its back foot. Last summer we devastated Iran's nuclear facilities. In recent weeks, we have eliminated Iran's top leadership, pummeled its military, sunk its navy, destroyed its missiles, neutered its proxies, and left its economy reeling. After forty-seven years of indecision and timidity, America has finally put our foot down. I'm also pleased to report that things have improved a lot in our own backyard, now that Venezuela's illegitimate communist dictator Nicholas Maduro is rotting in a New York prison. Only the United States could execute a military and intelligence operation of this difficulty without a single uh American life lost. Our military is awesome. But these operations wouldn't have succeeded and they probably wouldn't have even been tried without timely, accurate, and fact-based intelligence from your agencies. These successful operations are a testament to our intelligence professionals' ability to expose and uncover critical details about America's enemies. So let this be a warning to those who wish America harm. We leave no stone unturned. And there's no one or no thing close to you that might not betray you. Today's hearing is an opportunity for the American people to hear an unvarnished and unbiased account of the remaining threats we face, from Communist China, North Korea and Russia to the East, to narco-terrorist cartels here at home. These threats truly do span the globe. And for my second point, your agencies have improved over the last year, thanks to reforms that has gotten them back to basics. Of course, my two points are related. When our intelligence agencies return to their core mission, stealing the secrets of our adversaries to deliver timely and needful intelligence, America is safer for it. These efforts are already bearing fruit. For example, last year the CIA increased its foreign intelligence reporting by twenty-five percent. This year, the CIA is on track to hire and deploy more officers than at any point in the last quarter century. While I'm greatly encouraged by the progress, more remains to be done. We must always equip our intelligence personnel with the tools they need to do their jobs well, and execute their missions. That's why I fully support President Trump's request for a clean reauthorization of FISA section seven O two. And it's why I expect a healthy intelligence budget request in the administration's supplemental appropriations request to fund operations against Iran and narco-terrorists. No doubt our military needs supplemental funding, but our intelligence agencies need it just as badly. Moreover, I urge each of you to continue to make personnel and institutional reforms that will cement cement these changes and foreclose a return in the future to bureaucratic bloat, political bias, and excessive caution within your services. When I became chairman, I promised real reform across the entire intelligence community. Our first Intelligence Authorization Act set the foundation for a more efficient intelligence community by, for example, reorganizing the ODNI, improving the security of CIA installations, and directing resources towards foreign intelligence collection and covert action. This year I look forward to going further, namely by growing our cadre of collectors, making generational investments in core capabilities, providing new capabilities to defend our space assets, and further codifying reforms to guard against any future return of bloated and biased bureaucracy. I look forward to working with you towards these ends. I now recognize the Vice Chairman.

Sen. Warner (VA)25:07 – 38:32

Um, thank you, Mister Chairman, and let me also offer a good morning to our witnesses. Um, let me also join you, Mister Chairman, by and begin by thanking, literally, the tens of thousands of men and women across America's intelligence community. who work every day to keep our country safe. Their work is by necessity secret. That is the nature of intelligence. But that is also why hearings like this one matter so much. Over the past year, we have seen a series of developments that raise serious concerns about the erosion of safeguards that protect both our democracy and our security. And nowhere is that more worrying than when it comes to the integrity of our elections. For decades now, our intelligence community has warned that foreign adversaries, including Russia, China, and Iran, are actively seeking to shape the outcome of American elections. These efforts have included cyber-intrusions, disinformation campaigns, and covert influence operations designed to divide Americans and undermine our confidence in our democratic institutions. Protecting our elections from these threats should be one of the intelligence community's highest priorities. The D N I is supposed to be coordinating intelligence on foreign election interference, warning the American people about adversaries seeking to undermine our democracy, ensuring that federal, state, and local officials have the information they need, Congress even required the creation of a foreign malign influence center inside the office of the DNI to coordinate the intelligence community's response to foreign election interference and ensure that these threats are properly shared across the government. That is the mission Congress assigned to the DNI. But while foreign adversaries are actively probing our democratic institutions, the DNI has eliminated the foreign malign influence center and does not have a designated official coordinating the response to election threats. And for months the committee has reportedly, has repeatedly requested briefings from the IC, briefings that are required by law on legitimate foreign threats to the midterms. We have received no response. Now that silence, I believe, should concern every member of the committee. Because it clearly demonstrates the DNI is not interested in protecting American democracy by combating foreign influence. Instead, unfortunately, we have seen the DNI involve herself in purely domestic matters. Last month, we saw Director Gabbard personally participate in a law enforcement raid to seize election ballots. in voting machine records in Fulton County, Georgia. A raid tied to an election that the president lost six years ago. When the warrant supporting the raid was unsealed, it showed something deeply troubling. There was no foreign connection to justify the involvement of our nation's top spy. Instead, the predicate for the warrant was a slop of debunked conspiracy theories that had already been rejected repeatedly by courts, by independent investigators, and by even by George's own Republican Secretary of State. Yet the nation's top intelligence officer official was personally involved in this operation. This raises one very ser serious question. If the intelligence community is not being deployed to mobilize agin- to mobilize against foreign threats, why is it being deployed at all on a domestic issue the d n i s appearance at this rate as well as her involvement in seizing seizing voting machines from puerto rico suggests something that should also alarm every american i believe in organized effort to misuse her national security powers to interfere in domestic politics and potentially provide a pretext for the president's unconstitutional efforts to seize control of the upcoming elections. Don't take my word for it. The president has repeatedly pushed for the nationalization of our elections, calling for federal government to override the state election laws and quote, "take over" voting while continuing to make false statements about election fraud. And we have heard troubling rhetoric from senior officials that reinforce these concerns. As former Homeland Security Secretary Christy Noem said publicly, "We've been," and this is a quote, " We've been proactive, trying to make sure we have the right people voting, electing the right leaders to lead this country." At the same time, the administration has brought into government individuals promoting conspiracy theories about our elections. The so-called White House Director of Election Security and Integrity Kurt Olsen played a key role in efforts to overturn the results of the twenty twenty election. Now, mister Olsen holds a position inside the federal government with the ref- authority to refer criminal investigations and access our most sensitive security information. All supposedly doing his witch hunts around elections. Matter of fact, according to the court filings, he helped trigger the FBI's seizure of the ballots and Fulton County. So it is worth asking why is someone whose career has been devoted to undermining the legitimate results of a democratic election, now operating from inside the federal government, with access to law enforcement and intelligence authorities, what exactly has he been empowered to do? As members of our committee know, this crea uh, as members know, this committee was created in the aftermath of the unconstitutional abuses exposed after Watergate. The guardrails have been built around our intelligence and law enforcement agencies over the past several decades exist for a reason. Without them, America begins to look more like adversaries, emphasized in this year's annual threat assessment. China, Russia, Iran, North Korea, and less like a democracy. Confront confronting these very clear and present threats to American security requires experienced professionals and ex- intelligence agencies that are focused squarely on their mission. Instead, over the past year we've seen actions that only serve to weaken them. Politically motivated purges at the FBI has resulted in the exodus of hundreds of agents. and the reassignments of hundreds more from key national security areas, like counterintelligence, counterterrorism, and cyber, and where they've been redeployed to immigration enforcement. In one troubling case, agents working on a task force focused on threats from Iran, clearly something that's pretty damn important right now, were dismissed because they had previously participated in the investigation of the president's mishandling of classified information. Elsewhere, the Bureau's budget is being slashed. Last year it cut over five hundred million dollars, with the largest decreases from cyber, counterterrorism, and counterespionage. And the remaining scarce resources are being squandered on things like a sixty million dollar jet for the director's personal travel, so it can go golfing in Scotland or parting with athletes in Milan. In fact, according to a whistle-blower account, those flights became so frequent they even delayed the bureau's response to major incidents like the Charlie Kirk assassination or the shooting at Brown University. Credible reports also indicate that highly trained FBI agents from elite SWAT units have been reassigned to chauffeur his girlfriend, an unprecedented use of personnel whose training intended are actually intended for hunting violent criminals and neutralizing terrorists. Unfortunately, this dysfunction has not been limited to the FBI. Both the National Security Agency and the Defense Intelligence Agency, and this is no reflection on the two gentlemen sitting in front of us, were both left leaderless for months after the president fired their directors. One at the behest of a nine eleven conspiracy theorist. And the other, for providing a fact-based assessment that contradicted the president's claims about obliterating Iran's nuclear program. Clearly if the program had been truly obliterated, the president wouldn't be bombing again right now. And again, more than one third of the personnel at SISC, created by Congress to protect critical infrastructure, like power, water, and election systems, have been forced out. That seems like a real mistake, as we still grapple with the intrusion called Sight-Ti-Syphon and the recent Iranian cyber-attack on Stryker. And we are now seeing in real time the cost to the State Department. Thousands of American citizens were trapped in a literal war zone with little assistance from their own government. For a time, those calling the State Department hotline for assistance were greeted with a pre-recorded message that said, quote, please do not require rely on the US government for assisted departure or evacuation. This was a foreseeable security crisis. When you start a war of choice, when there was no imminent threat, you should be able to prepare to make sure you get Americans out of the war zone. That same attitude pushing some of our closest friends into the arms of our most capable foes has profound consequences. Two of our most significant allies, Canada and the UK, are currently working to sign trade deals with China because they no longer believe the United States is a dependable partner. That's a remarkable statement in twenty twenty six. And in the president's war of choice with Iran, war that has already killed thirteen service members, cost Americans, taxpayers, billions of dollars, and scrambled supply chains from oil to fertilizer to aluminum, nobody answered the call when the president asked our allies to help reopen the Strait of Hormuz. As the president's own counterterrorism chief acknowledged in his resignation yesterday, Iran posed no imminent threat the united states unfortunately our allies have been alienated and distracted by the administration's unilateral threats like invading greenland and the result is clear americans have been left more exposed in an already dangerous conflict now what i say what i just outlined is quite a list and it's a partial one at that matter of fact we've got a full list we'd like to share with all the press So what does this all mean? It matters because I believe the warnings contained in this year's annual threat assessment. I believe our IC when they say the global security environment is becoming more complex. And that armed conflict is becoming more global. And I also agree with the assessment when it says that to succeed, we must think prudently and prioritize our efforts. On the topic of the annual threat assessment, I wanna close where I began by noting that since the first time since twenty seventeen in the aftermath of Russia's intervention in our twenty sixteen elections, the annual threat assessment includes nothing, nothing, about adversary attempts to influence American elections. Now, I don't believe this omission means that the threat is disappeared. It means that the intelligence community is no longer being allowed to speak honestly about it. And it raises serious questions. And I will be asking about the, your priorities, Director Gabbert, in terms of what you're choosing to prioritize instead. Thank you, Mister Chairman. I yield back.

Sen. Cotton (AR)38:33 – 39:03

Before we go to the witnesses, now that we have a critical mass of members, I would simply like to remind members that we will handle questions as we did last year, uh seniority. uh, at the time of the gavel and alternating between Democrats and Republicans. We'll have one round of questions, seven minutes per round. I will not entertain questions after seven minute time has expired. Furthermore, I expect to convene the closed session in our usual location promptly thirty minutes after the open session begins. Director Gabbard, the floor is yours.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)39:05 – 40:00

Thank you, Chairman Cotton, Vice Chair Warner, members of the committee, good morning. I'm here today to present the twenty twenty six annual threat assessment, joined by the directors of the CIA, FBI, DIA and NSA. Uh, before I continue, on behalf of the intelligence community, want to extend our thanks to General Hartman for his thirty seven years of service in uniform, and closing out his thirty seven years with tremendous leadership of the NSA. This briefing is being provided in accordance with ODNI's statutory responsibility. I'd like to remind those who are watching what I am briefing here today, conveys the intelligence community's assessment of the threats facing US citizens our homeland and our interests not my personal views or opinions. In this assessment, we're following the structure of priorities that were laid out in the President's National Security Strategy,

Sen. Cotton (AR)40:00 – 40:01

Nice web.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)40:01 – 1:01:10

starting with threats to our homeland and then shifting to global risks. The defense of our homeland is of the utmost importance. to the American people. And efforts by this administration have shown over the last year, the results of bolstering homeland defense in the security of the American people. For example, the strict enforcement of US policies at the US-Mexico border and regionally have served as a deterrent, drastically reducing illegal immigration. Based on Customs and Border Patrol data, January twenty twenty-six's monthly encounters are down eighty-three point eight percent compared to January, twenty twenty five. Encounters declined seventy nine percent compared to twenty twenty four. The drivers of migration are likely to continue. Potential worsening instability in countries like Cuba and Haiti risk triggering migration surges, and smugglers who have long operated as transnational criminal organizations continue to view chaos as an opportunity for profit, and will continue to look to profit from illegal immigration flows. These transnational criminal organizations continue to pose a daily and direct threat to the health and safety of millions of US citizens, primarily and directly by producing and trafficking in illegal drugs. Under President Trump's leadership, fentanyl overdose deaths have seen a thirty percent decrease from September twenty twenty four to September twenty twenty five. President Trump's aggressive efforts to more directly and actively target these transnational criminal organizations and the inflow of fentanyl precursors has already had a significant impact, which is likely to continue. We've seen fentanyl potency also decrease, likely due to disruptions to the production supply chain. US efforts to work with China and India to halt the flow of fent- fentanyl precursor chemicals to North America are demonstrating some improvement, but there is more work to be done, as sadly, there are still tens of thousands of fentanyl-related deaths in America. every year. Mexico-based TCOs like the Sinaloa cartel and Jalisco new generation cartel dominate the production and smuggling of fentanyl, heroin, meth, and cocaine into the United States. Columbia-based TCOs and illegal armed groups like the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Columbia and the National Liberation Army are responsible for producing and trafficking large volumes of cocaine to the US and European markets with now some indicators of attempts to expand their market to the Asia-Pacific region. Colombia remains the world's largest producer of cocaine, and Colombian criminal groups have expanded their trafficking relationships with the n- neighboring Ecuadorian and Brazilian gangs. As you know, MS thirteen is well established in cells within the United States and uses violence to in- intimidate the Salvadoran diaspora, engaging in murder, extortion, retail drug trafficking, firearms offenses and prostitution, fueling increased violence and instability. These and other TCOs continue to present a very tangible and individualized risk of violent crime to everyday Americans, and contribute to regional instability. As the president increases his focus on counter-drug and counter-cartel pressures, they're likely to seek ways to try to adapt their operations, including shifting production locations and trafficking routes and methods. The United States continues to face a complex and evolving threat landscape with a geographically geographically diverse set of Islamist terrorist actors, seeking to propagate their ideology globally and harm Americans, even as Al-Qaeda and ISIS remain weaker today than they were at their respective peaks. The spread of Islamist ideology, in some cases led by individuals and organizations associated with the Muslim Brotherhood poses a fundamental threat to freedom and the foundational that underp- underpin Western civilization. Islamist groups and individuals use this ideology for recruiting and financial support for terrorist groups and individuals around the world and to advance their political objectives of establishing is an Islamist caliphate, which governs based on Sharia. There are increasing examples of this in various European countries, and President Trump's designation of certain Muslim Brotherhood chapters as foreign terrorist organizations is a mechanism to secure Americans against In response to setbacks to their capabilities of conducting large scale complex attacks Islamist terrorist groups have shifted toward focusing on executing information operations to spread propaganda and inspire or enable individuals located in or with access to the West. US counterterrorism efforts, primarily in Iraq, Somalia, Yemen and Syria in twenty twenty five were instrumental in removing key terrorist leaders and operatives, degrading the ability of Al-Qaeda and ISIS to quickly reconstitute its leadership, and plan large-scale attacks against the homeland and US interests abroad. Strict US border enforcement measures and increased deportations of individuals with suspected links to Islamist terrorists have reduced access to the homeland and removed some potential sources of future terrorist attacks. Since January, Many of our official have only had a handful of encounters at our borders with individuals associated with terrorist groups. This is a positive trend. However, our inter-agency coordinated efforts to continue to identify, locate and remove known or suspected terrorists who may already be in the United States continues with vigilance. In twenty twenty five, there were at least three Islamist terrorist attacks in the United States. Law enforcement disrupted fifteen US-based Islamist terrorist plotters. Roughly half of last year's disrupted plotters had some on-line contact with Islamist terrorists inspired by Islamist foreign terrorist organizations abroad. For example, in the recent attempt to attack a synagogue in Michigan, the shooter had familial ties to a Hezbollah leader. Al-Qaeda and ISIS pose the biggest threat to US interests overseas, in parts of Africa, the Middle East and South Asia, where these groups operate. In the Middle East, AQAP in Yemen, ISIS-K in South Asia, and ISIS in Syria are among the most likely groups conducting external plotting. ISIS in Syria is likely seeking to rebuild its ranks, expand support networks, and solicit funds by re-engaging with and recruiting from the likely hundreds of ISIS detainees, and thousands of ISIS-linked women and children who were either released or escaped from prisons and displaced person camps. that were previously run by the Syrian Democratic Forces in northeast Syria. Meanwhile, state actors present a risk broader in scope by seeking new capabilities in kinetic and cyber warfare. The United States' secure nuclear deterrent continues to ensure safety in the homeland against strategic threats. However, the intelligence community assesses that Russia, China, North Korea, Iran and Pakistan have been researching and developing an array of novel advanced or traditional missile delivery systems with nuclear and conventional payloads that put our homeland within range. The IC assesses that threats to the homeland will expand collectively to more than sixteen thousand missiles by twenty thirty five from the current assessed figure of more than three thousand missiles. The IC assesses that China and Russia are developing advanced delivery systems meant to be capable of penetrating or bypassing US missile defenses. North Korea's ICBMs can already reach US soil, and the ICSS is that it is committed to expanding its nuclear arsenal. Pakistan's long-range ballistic missile development potentially could include ICBMs with a range capable of striking the homeland. The ICSS's that Iran has previously demonstrated space launch and other technology, it could use to begin to develop a militarily viable ICBM before twenty thirty five, should Tehran attempt to pursue that capability. However, these assessments will clearly be updated as the full impact of Operation Epic Fury's devastating strikes on Iran's missile production facilities, stockpiles, and launch capabilities is determined. These nations collectively will likely seek to understand US plans for advanced missile defense for the homeland, probably for the purpose of shaping their own missile development programs, and assessing US intentions regarding deterrence. Shifting to the cyber domain, the IC assesses that China, Russia, Iran, North Korea and non-state ransomware groups will continue to seek to compromise US government and private sector networks, as well as critical infrastructure, to collect intelligence, create options for future disruption and for financial gain. The IC assesses that China and Russia present the most persistent and active threats and are continuing their R and D efforts. North Korea's cyber program is sophisticated and agile. In twenty twenty five alone, North Korea's cryptocurrency heist probably stole two billion dollars, which the ICSS is helping to fund the regime and include further development of its strategic weapons programs. Financially or ideologically motivated non-state actors are becoming more bold, with ransomware groups shifting to faster high-volume attacks that are harder to identify and mitigate. Innovation in the field of artificial intelligence. will likely accelerate these threats in the cyber domain. The ICSS's that it will increasingly shape cyber operations with both cyber operators and defenders using these tools to improve their speed and effectiveness. For example, in August of twenty twenty five, cyber actors used an AI tool to conduct a data extortion operation against international government healthcare and public health emergency service sectors, as well as religious institutions. Moving to the Arctic, the IC assesses that Russia, and to a lesser extent China, aim to strengthen their presence in the region through increased maritime trade, natural resource extraction, and military activity. Russia, which has the longest coastline in the Arctic, has long sought recognition of its polar great power status, and is deploying more military forces and building new permanent infrastructure. China, though not an Arctic country, is engaged in more limited efforts in the region to advance its own strategic and economic The ICSS's that China is the most capable competitor in the field of artificial intelligence. The ICSS's that AI capabilities are rapidly advancing and changing the threat landscape. As this is a defining technology that enables computers and machines to simulate human learning comprehension, problem solving, creativity, and autonomy, it will be critical to ensure that humans remain in control of how AI is used, and of the machines that may threaten to autonomously violate the interests of the American people across all domains. AI adoption at scale across the spectrum of usage poses serious risks. AI has the potential to aid in weapons and systems design, has been used in recent conflicts to influence targeting and streamline decision making underscoring the risk and likely threats that could manifest on the battlefield early developers in the quantum in quantum computers will give countries an extraordinary technological advantage over others to quickly process national security information and break current encryption methodology used to protect sensitive finance, health care, and government information. The global security landscape is volatile and complex, with armed conflict growing more common and posing potential threats against US interests. Strategic competition and regional and smaller powers are becoming more willing to use force to pursue their interests, heightening the risk of conflict. The ICSS's the space domain is becoming increasingly contested, with China and Russia developing counter space capabilities to challenge US space efforts. The threat of nuclear proliferation and advancing chemical and biological warfare capabilities continues to grow. I'll turn now to our neighborhood in the Western Hemisphere, where flagging economies high crime rates, pervasive organized crime, migration flows, corruption, narcotics trafficking, all of these present a spectrum of risks to US interests, and where strategic competitors seek to gain greater influence in the region. The IC assesses that Latin America and the Caribbean almost certainly will see hot spots of vol- volatility in the coming year. Since Maduro's arrest, the IC assesses a shift in Venezuela's leadership, towards cooperating with the US to open its economy, to develop the country's oil and gas extraction capability, and we've seen their movement in releasing political prisoners. The US-Mexico-Canada Agreement review in twenty twenty six will likely increase uncertainty in many Latin American countries, especially those that rely on Mexico as an export destination for intermediate goods for manufacture and onward export to the US. China, Russia and Iran are likely seeking to sustain economic, political, and military engagement with Latin America. The ICSS's that China's demand for raw materials is likely to continue to drive its economic outreach, while Russia likely wants to expand its current security and diplomatic ties with Cuba and Nicaragua. The ICSS's that China aims to elevate its own political, economic, military, and technological power to increase its own regional positioning. global influence to fend off threats to their interests. While there are challenging areas where interests diverge, President Trump's diplomatic engagements with Pres- President Xi to work towards US interests have enabled progress where those interests align. The ICSS says that China continues to rapidly modernize its military forces across all domains in pursuit of its goal to achieve world-class status by mid-century. This includes with the aim of being capable of deterring US and allied forces in the region, and to achieve their stated objective of developing the ability to seize Taiwan by force if necessary. However, the IC assesses that China likely prefer prefers to set the conditions for an eventual peaceful reunification with Taiwan short of conflict. The IC assesses that an increasingly confident North Korean regime remains a source of concern regionally and globally. Its weapons of mass destruction, conventional military capabilities, illicit cyber activities and demonstrated willingness to use asymmetric capabilities poses a threat to US and its allies, particularly South Korea and Japan. North Korea's partnership with Russia is growing. And in twenty twenty five, Kim took steps to improve ties with China, still North Korea's most important trading partner and economic benefactor. The ICSS's that North Korea's support for Russia in the war against Ukraine has increased Korea's capabilities as their forces have gained combat experience in twenty-first century warfare along with equipment. In twenty twenty four, North Korea deployed more than eleven thousand troops to Russia to support combat operations in Kursk. Pyongyang continues to develop and expand its strategic weapons programs, including missiles that can evade US and regional missile defenses. It is continuing to work to increase its nuclear warhead stockpile. and maintains biological and chemical weapons capabilities. Russia retains the capability to selectively challenge US interests globally by military and non-military means. The ICSS says that the most dangerous threat posed by Russia to the US is the potential of an escalatory spiral in an ongoing conflict, such as Ukraine, or a new conflict that led to direct hostilities, including the potential deployment of nuclear weapons. The ICSS's that Putin continues to invest in Russia's defense industrial base, as well as novel capabilities that may pose a greater threat to the US homeland and forces abroad than conventional weapons. Russia has advanced systems, hypersonic missiles, and undersea capabilities designed to negate US military advantage. Moscow also relies on other tools to exert pressure, using gray zone tactics to further its goals and compete below the level of armed conflict. Russia is also building an extensive counter space capabilities to contest US space dominance. Its development of a nuclear counter space weapon poses the greatest single threat to the world's space architecture. During the past year, the ICSS is that Russia has maintained the upper hand in the war against Ukraine. US-led negotiations between Moscow and Kiev are ongoing. Until such an agreement is met, Moscow is likely to continue fighting a slow war of attrition. until they view their objectives have been achieved. In the Middle East, conflict and instability will shape security, political and economic dynamics in a variety of ways. The ICSS says that Operation Epic Fury is advancing fundamental change in the region that began with Hamas's attack on Israel, in Oc- on October seventh, twenty twenty three, and continued with the twelve day war last year, resulting in weakening Iran and its proxies. The ICSS's the regime in Iran appears to be intact but largely degraded, due to attacks on its leadership and military capabilities. Its conventional military power projection capabilities have largely been destroyed, leaving limited options. Iran's strategic position has been significantly degraded. The US-led maximum pressure campaign and snapback of European sanctions added additional pressure to an already bleak Iranian economy resulting in mass protest earlier this year that Tehran suppressed by killing thousands of protesters. Even if the regime remains intact, the ICSS says that internal tensions are likely to increase as econ- as Iran's economy worsens. Even so, Iran and its proxies continue to attack US and allied interests in the Middle East. The ICSS says that if a hostile regime survives, it will likely seek to begin a years-long effort to rebuild its military, missiles, and UAV forces. Prior to Operation Epic Fury, the ICSS's Iran was trying to recover from the severe damage to its nuclear infrastructure sustained during the Twelve Day War, and continued to refuse to comply with its nuclear obligations with the IAEA, refusing them access to key facilities. The ICSS's that China, Russia, and North Korea see the United States as a strategic competitor and potential adversary. Iran has long viewed the US as an adversary and is engaged in active conflict with the US as of today. These four countries, the ICSSs are likely to continue their selective cooperation with each other, which could bolster their individual capabilities and threats to US interests more broadly. However, currently these relationships are primarily bilateral on selective issues and depend on broader circumstances, divergent sovereign interests, and in some cases, concerns over directly confronting the United States. These factors, the ICSS's are likely to constrain their relationships. Finally, conflicts on the continent of Africa are likely to persist through twenty twenty six due to poor governance economic demands and external support. Tensions continue between Ethiopia and Eritrea, which could rapidly accelerate to conflict. Contentious national elections in Somalia could distract the federal government away from counterterrorism actions. against al-Shabaab, which continues to conduct terror attacks while providing funding and propaganda support to other elements of Al-Qaeda in Yemen. The civil war in Sudan continues, even as external negotiations occur. ISIS in West Africa and the Sahel have increased the intensity of their attacks against local security forces, expanding their areas of operation and moving closer to cities with the US presence. The ICSS's that African governments will likely use their wealth and critical minerals to seek partnerships that deliver them meaningful benefit. Concurrent conflicts and crises across the continent will continue to put US citizens at risk and cause further instability. In closing, as leaders of the intelligence community, we remain committed to providing the president and policy makers with timely, unbiased, relevant intelligence to inform decision making and to ensure the safety, security and freedom of the American people. Thank you.

Sen. Cotton (AR)1:01:10 – 1:01:33

Thank you, Director Gabbard. General Adams, Camden, Arkansas is the home of brand new production lines for the Israeli missile defense interceptors. Could you please explain how critical arrow and iron dome systems being built in Camden um are for not only Israel's defenses, but the defense of hundreds of thousands of American citizens and troops in the region?

James H. Adams III (Witness)1:01:34 – 1:02:24

Uh, Chairman Cotton, uh, thank you for that question, and uh, I I have to say that the Aero system and the Iron Dome system are critical defensive systems that prevent uh uh adversary power projection from impacting um the uh, the the targets in the friendly areas i- in Israel. The Aero system itself is uh the high altitude, primarily against uh MRBMs, yeah, and it's proven to be very, very effective against those uh systems. The Iron Dome uh is more of a closer-in system, uh protecting against rockets and things of that nature. But the combination of those two with uh U uh US uh systems creates a shield, uh to prevent uh those attacks from the Iranians uh impacting key areas in uh in in areas where they're protecting.

Sen. Cotton (AR)1:02:25 – 1:02:57

Thank you, General Adams. Uh, I was recently in Camden with Secretary Hegseth as part of his Arsenal of Freedom tour, and they or greater Kansans who do great work to keep our nation safe. Uh, General Hartman, we've often spoken about our pressing need for more cyber security manpower and part-time formation such as the Arkansas Air National Guards, two hundred and twenty-third Cyber Space Operations Squadron are a great way to grow the force. What recommendations do you have to grow the cyber protection teams and develop more capacity for local and national missions?

William J. Hartman (Witness)1:02:59 – 1:03:57

chairman cotton thank thanks for the question um i uh did hear a little bit about the great team in uh arkansas there and i know eight fifty five cpt uh operates from that formation and so for us certainly looking at a number of different initiatives one ensure that we can share all of the relevant top secret classified information and uh other uh sort of indications and warning that the organizations need but i will tell you i'm an advocate for uh inability to establish some sort of joint reserve cyber organization and so that at cyber comm we can insure that those organizations uh have all of the advanced training that they need uh to insure that those organizations have access to all of the intelligence that they need uh and to insure that we control some level of funding at both cyber comm and nsa uh that can be used to mobilize those personnel to handle the most difficult problems that we're faced with uh and we have been working with congress on some of that language and the department and we appreciate it sir

Sen. Cotton (AR)1:03:58 – 1:04:37

Thank you, General Hartman. As I said in my opening, um, we only have this one public hearing a year, even though the committee hears from each of you several times throughout the year in classified settings. Um, so we don't often have a chance to tell the American people what great work their intelligence professionals are doing for them. So, Director Ratcliffe, um, could, could you take the opportunity to, to maybe join in the excellent briefings that Secretary Hegseth and General Kane have provided on a regular basis. um, over the last couple months, um, on the military aspects of both the Maduro raid and Operation Epic Fury, to explain the CIA's contributions to those operations.

John Ratcliffe (Witness)1:04:38 – 1:07:09

Uh, thank you, Senator. Um, you know, last year when I was here, uh, in in my confirmation, uh, I promised you all, and you had all asked for, a more aggressive CIA, one that was focused on core mission, getting back to the business of stealing secrets. to be able to provide our policymakers with a decisive strategic advantage that would allow, uh, an advance and contribute to foreign policy and national security successes. To the credit of the CIA workforce, um, the CIA has delivered. Uh, some of those successes have been very public. Um, as you mentioned, Senator, uh, Operation Midnight Hammer, Operation Absolute Res- Flawless military operations like that are hostage to, uh, a flawless intelligence picture and the CIA, uh, as you know from classified briefings, contributed in myriad ways to the success of that. But what I would say to you is, uh, those successes are just emblematic of the phenomenal progress and success really by every measure, every metric, every standard across every national security space. Uh, with regard to the work of the CIA, uh, Senator, you mentioned some of it in your opening. Um, the increase of our asset stable, um, and our human sources up by twenty-five percent. Our FI collection across the board, our foreign intelligence collection, uh, up by f- twenty-five percent overall, and in important categories like China, for instance, up a hundred percent. Uh, in areas like tech and AI, up forty-five percent. On the counter-narcotics front, our operations up by seventy percent. And with regard to counterterrorism, uh, those are classified numbers that I'll share with you in the classified portion of this hearing, but they're off the charts good. Um, the best way I can summarize it, um, Senator, is I had a thirty-two year veteran, uh, of the agency retire this year and he said to me, I hate to go. Uh, I don't know if it's the best year that the CI has ever had, but it's the best year I can ever remember. And I think that reflects the current morale of the of the CIA. It's a workforce that knows it's doing a great job. It's know it's it's it knows that it's being allowed to do what they signed up to do, which is uh provide that decisive strategic advantage uh to our country for great successes that everyone can see. So I thank you for the opportunity to let me uh recognize the CIA workforce.

Sen. Cotton (AR)1:07:10 – 1:07:53

Thank you. I, Director Ratcliffe, I wanna address one specific threat from Iran, the threat of an intercontinental missile. Which is really just the combination of two technologies, one thrust to get something into space and a re-entry vehicle to get it back to Earth. Um, Iran has always had a space launch program, which is flimsy cover. For the first part of that intercontinental missile program, I haven't seen any Iranian astronauts in space lately. And second, they have medium range ballistic missiles, which already have a re-entry vehicle. So if you crudely married those two technologies together, um, I've heard some analysts say that Iran could have had a uh, functioning intercontinental missile to threaten the United States in as few as six months. Would you agree with that assessment?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)1:07:53 – 1:08:44

Well, you're uh, you're right to be concerned about Iran's uh, development of longer range ballistic missiles, Senator. If, if, if Iran were allowed, uh, to develop at the IRBR IRBM ranges, which is three thousand kilometers, it would uh, it would threaten most of Europe. And yes, as you mentioned, um, we know that Iran is gaining experience in these larger uh, more powerful booster technologies through its, uh, so-called space launch vehicle program. Um, if left um, uh, unimpeded, yes, uh, Senator, uh, they would have the ability to, uh, range missiles to the continental US. Um, it's one of the reasons why degrading Iran's, um, uh, missile production capabilities that is taking place right now in Operation Epic Fury is so important to our national security.

Sen. Cotton (AR)1:08:45 – 1:08:46

Thank you. Bye, Chairman.

Sen. Warner (VA)1:08:47 – 1:09:22

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Um, Dr. Gab, Dr. Gabbert, the um whole country knows that you were recently involved in a FBI operation to seize ballots in Fulton County, Georgia. Yet, this was despite the fact that the warrant showed no foreign interference or nexus. Matter of fact, the warrant was based entirely on conspiracy theories that have already been examined and rejected repeatedly. Now, where is the authority for you to involve yourself in a domestic law enforcement activity?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:09:25 – 1:09:49

Thank you, Vice Chairman. I appreciate the question. I, as you know, I've addressed uh every issue you've raised in detail in a letter, but I'm grateful for the opportunity to do it in this forum. Uh, as you stated, Congress provided uh by statute, ODNI, with the responsibility of election security and counterintelligence. uh in twenty twenty one. Uh as you also know, ODNI has purview and oversight.

Sen. Warner (VA)1:09:48 – 1:09:53

Ma'am, could you, could you, I I I know the history very well, but could you just dir- address where

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:09:52 – 1:10:21

I I am addressing the question. ODNI also uh has purview and overview over two uh domestic related agencies, the Department of Homeland Security and the FBI, both of which have purview over election security responsibilities, to ensure the integrity of our elections. Uh I wanna correct one of your statements that you've made multiple times, which is false. I did not participate in a law enforcement activity, nor would I, because that does not exist within my authorities.

Sen. Warner (VA)1:10:21 – 1:10:22

You were present on the scene.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:10:21 – 1:10:24

I was at Fulton, I was at Fulton County.

Sen. Warner (VA)1:10:22 – 1:10:25

There are the photos, are the photos of you on the scene false?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:10:24 – 1:10:39

I was, I was at Fulton County, sir, uh, at the request of the president and to work with the FBI to observe this action, uh, that had long been awaited, I was not aware of what was in the warrant or was not in the warrant,

Sen. Warner (VA)1:10:38 – 1:10:40

And, and what was the president's specific request for you to go to,

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:10:39 – 1:10:43

and to say thank you to the FBI agent for their work.

Sen. Warner (VA)1:10:41 – 1:10:45

what was the specific request that was made by the president? For you to show up in Fulton County.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:10:44 – 1:10:48

To go and observe the FBI's activities on this issue.

Sen. Warner (VA)1:10:48 – 1:10:52

So why why do you have the answer of do you have the answer why

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:10:49 – 1:10:51

When you look at the for your question, sir.

Sen. Warner (VA)1:10:52 – 1:10:55

the president was knowing about this affidavit before it was even served?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:10:53 – 1:10:59

Your question, sir. I'm not aware that the president knew about an affidavit before it was served.

Sen. Warner (VA)1:10:59 – 1:11:01

Then why was he sending you to Fulton County?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:11:01 – 1:11:10

This occurred the day that the FBI had it approved, they're Warren approved by a local judge, and they began to execute this.

Sen. Warner (VA)1:11:10 – 1:11:10

Director Gamble.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:11:10 – 1:11:27

Could you ask your question, sir, about the foreign nexus question? in order for us to better understand the vulnerabilities in our election systems that may exist today, as we look to twenty twenty six. And yes, we are very focused on trying to make sure that this election is one that the American people have faith in,

Sen. Warner (VA)1:11:26 – 1:11:28

I, Director Gabin, let me, I've got a number of questions.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:11:28 – 1:11:29

and count their votes as passive.

Sen. Warner (VA)1:11:29 – 1:12:03

Director Gabin, I have a number of questions. Let me ask my next question, please. Um. You have not provided any of the required reports or briefings to this committee on foreign interference. This is the first threat assessment since twenty seventeen that didn't even mention foreign interference. Last uh year when you were in already um uh confirmed, it mentioned it at high level. Are you saying there is no foreign threat to our elections in the midterms this year?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:12:05 – 1:12:12

As I stated in the outset of my remarks, this year's annual threat assessment matches the prioritization of

Sen. Warner (VA)1:12:12 – 1:12:13

Please answer the question,

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:12:12 – 1:12:13

threats and focus.

Sen. Warner (VA)1:12:13 – 1:12:17

yes or no, is there foreign threat interference to our elections this year?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:12:16 – 1:12:17

That the president has laid out.

Sen. Warner (VA)1:12:17 – 1:12:18

Are there foreign

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:12:18 – 1:12:27

Our int- Please allow me to answer the question, sir. The intelligence community has been and continues to remain focused on any collection and intelligence products that show a

Sen. Warner (VA)1:12:26 – 1:12:27

Ma'am, you're you're Ma'am,

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:12:27 – 1:12:34

potential foreign threat for those who are seeking to invade our election system.

Sen. Warner (VA)1:12:28 – 1:12:39

you Ma'am So so far there has been none then because you've made no reports. Excuse me, Ma'am. If you want to ask the questions, you should have stayed in Congress. Please answer the questions.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:12:39 – 1:12:41

I didn't ask you a question, sir, I'm trying to answer your question.

Sen. Warner (VA)1:12:42 – 1:13:20

So you're saying the failure to provide any reports or the failure to have any mention of a foreign threat assessment, I would draw the conclusion there must be no foreign threat to our elections in twenty six. So that brings me a question that I have for both you ma'am and Director Patel. There are reports that in twenty twenty the president was preparing an executive order to potentially seize um ballots or bring in federal forces. There is a published report that there is a similar eo being drafted right now about twenty twenty six citing china director patel do you have any knowledge of that draft eo

Kash Patel (Witness)1:13:21 – 1:13:23

uh thank you vice chairman i do not sir

Sen. Warner (VA)1:13:23 – 1:13:24

director gabbert do you have any

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:13:25 – 1:13:26

i do not

Sen. Warner (VA)1:13:26 – 1:14:22

thank you let me move to iran now i i understand and i appreciated director gabbert's comments yesterday uh about uh agreeing that the president has sole authority i guess in his bones to declare whether something is an imminent threat um i didn't agree with uh your friend mr. kent but i didn't again i agreed with him yesterday on the fact that there was no imminent threat um i guess what i'm concerned about one thing is uh even in your printed testimony today on page six um and your last paragraph on page six as a result of operation midnight hammer rand's nuclear enrichment program was obliterated there's been no effort to try to rebuild their enrichment capability. You omitted that paragraph from your uh oral opening. Was that because the president had said there was a imminent threat two weeks c- uh from

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:14:22 – 1:14:26

Oh, sir, I I recognize that the time was running long and I skipped through some of the portions

Sen. Warner (VA)1:14:26 – 1:14:27

So you chose to,

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:14:26 – 1:14:31

of my of my oral of my oral delivered remarks,

Sen. Warner (VA)1:14:27 – 1:14:33

you chose to take, uh omit, you chose to omit the parts that can contradict the,

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:14:31 – 1:14:31

sir.

Sen. Warner (VA)1:14:33 – 1:14:53

the president. The president continues to say as well that, you know, he had no idea. It was shocked. that the Iranians would move to take over the Strait of Hormuz. Did you um provide any intelligence that would say that it would be um that it was not likely that the Iranians would try to move on the Strait?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:14:54 – 1:15:06

Uh, I'm not aware of those remarks, and I think those of us here at the table uh can point to the fact that historically the Iranians have always threatened to leverage their control over the Strait of Hormuz.

Sen. Warner (VA)1:15:04 – 1:15:07

But why would the president say he was amazed or um

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:15:06 – 1:15:08

I I'm not aware of those remarks.

Sen. Warner (VA)1:15:08 – 1:15:15

What about the comments the president made he was surprised again, reports um that Iran struck the adjacent Gulf states.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:15:15 – 1:15:20

Again, I'm I'm not aware of those remarks. We have been and continue to provide the intelligence

Sen. Warner (VA)1:15:18 – 1:15:23

I well, let me ask you this. Did you did you brief the president? Did you brief the president?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:15:22 – 1:15:23

decisions.

Sen. Warner (VA)1:15:23 – 1:15:45

Did you brief the president if he starts a war of choice that the likely result would be that Iran would strike adjacent Gulf nations and close the Strait of Hormuz? Did you brief him on those two facts that I think have been consistently the kind of the uh, assumptions of the intelligence community.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:15:45 – 1:15:58

Uh, I have not and won't divulge internal conversations. I will say that those of us within the intelligence community continue to provide the president with all of the best objective intelligence available to inform his decisions.

Sen. Cotton (AR)1:15:58 – 1:15:59

Senator Collins.

Sen. Collins (ME)1:16:00 – 1:18:00

Thank you, Mister Chairman. Director Gabber, you just testified that ISIS and Al-Qaeda are significantly weaker. And reflecting that view, you have devoted declining budgets, personnel, and emphasis on countering terrorism. Yet, the fact is that ISIS is growing and operating in Somalia Afghanistan, Syria, Pakistan and Iraq. Al-Qaida is surging in Afghanistan, the Arabian Peninsula and throughout Central Africa. The Houthis in Yemen and the rest of the Iranian proxies remain a serious threat. Focusing, as you have done, on great power competitors, seems to have diverted resources from the fight against terrorism, a fight that's very much still going on. As I have said repeatedly, it is terrorists who want and can kill Americans today. We've just seen the terrorists in Michigan attacking the synagogue. In addition, it appears that a more stove-piped effort in the intelligence committee has returned. How are you ensuring that Americans are safe and that you are countering counterterrorism threats to our homeland and to US citizens abroad?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:18:01 – 1:19:49

Thank you, Senator Collins, for your question and the opportunity to clarify the comments in my opening statement. Um, my reference to the size of ISIS and Al-Qaeda organizationally is smaller and weaker than it was during its peak over a decade ago. However, I completely concur with your remarks about the threat of ISIS, Al-Qaeda and other Islamist terrorist groups around the world, and the threat that they pose to US interest service members and directly to the homeland. Our ODNI National Counterterrorism Center has been at the forefront of ramping up and I believe is more active today than it has been certainly in a long time. We are dedicating every resource that they ask for, as well as the counterterrorism elements across the IC to make sure that we are never taking our eye off of this persistent threat to the American people. Uh, the change in tactics based on the current environment is something we continue to be most concerned about. Where increasingly we are seeing less indicators of large scale organized complex, uh, threats or attacks, and instead efforts focused on individuals either who have been radicalized by Islamist propaganda and may not have ever had contact with, uh, with ISIS or Al-Qaeda, for example, and others who have had contact, of which we'll we are able to have uh more indications of. Uh, this remains and will be, and and as we come to present our budgets to you, a foremost and primary priority, the integration across the intelligence community on the counterterrorism threat occurs every single day uh with our teams working very effectively together to thwart terrorist attacks as we have over the last year.

Sen. Collins (ME)1:19:49 – 1:20:47

Director Patel, I'm gonna follow up on this issue with you. ISIS targets potential recruits online through social media, gaming platforms, encrypted messaging apps. ISIS even facilitated a network online to smuggle illegal immigrants into the United States. Since April twenty twenty one, there have been more than fifty-two jihadist inspired cases across thirty states, what measures are the F is the FBI taking to prevent foreign terrorist organizations from recruiting or influencing Americans, while also ensuring the protection of individuals' right to privacy?

Kash Patel (Witness)1:20:48 – 1:21:54

Thank you, Senator, and I think you, um, said it best. They have um transferred their on- their capabilities in terms of personal recruitment to on-line recruitment which makes any terrorist organization, including ISIS, all the more powerful. What we have done is extended and expanded resources to environments like the threat screening center, which is allows us to collect biometric capabilities from all over the world. We've had a double digit increase in that and a double digit increase in intelligence production. But what we've also done in the CT space specifically is expand the number of agents and intel analysts that go online and and detect based on our biometric capabilities and intelligence that we have from the interagency. And what that leads us to is what we saw in December of last year, Senator, where we at the FBI stopped four um terrorist attacks, four in California, Texas, North Carolina, and Pennsylvania, three of which were ISIS inspired. We were able to detect these individuals both online and in person using our covert platforms. And we shuttered a bombing campaign in Southern California and two mass casualty events for New Year's Eve.

Sen. Collins (ME)1:21:57 – 1:22:54

Director Gabbard, the intelligence community did not detect an extremely serious breach affecting our telecommunications industry due to the Chinese salt typhoon incursions for a very long time. In addition, The Chinese volt typhoon threat is poses a terrible threat to US critical infrastructure. Specific sectors throughout the United States have been overlooked and under-protected. What are you doing to deal with the threat to critical infrastructure, our electric grid, our communication systems, given this huge mess by our talented intelligence community.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:22:55 – 1:23:55

Thank you, Senator Collins, for the question. Um, you know, working with our partners at NSA and others, uh, to detect these threats and how they may be evolve or developing is something we're continuing to work on. Uh, building strong partnerships with the private sector, whether it be in the telecom industry, the financial sector, the healthcare sector, the energy sector, is something that I am rebuilding. Uh, we've seen some of these ongoing relationships, uh, falter over previous years. I've personally been astounded by some of the conversations I've had with leaders from these industries uh who are just as concerned as we are about these threats to our critical infrastructure and yet uh don't feel that they have the connectivity or the information to be able to secure their own infrastructure. So in short, building those stronger partnerships, uh, integrating and being able to share information intelligence where we can, uh, is critical for us to be able to secure our country from these threats.

Sen. Cotton (AR)1:23:55 – 1:23:57

Thank you, Senator Collins. Senator Wyden.

Sen. Wyden (OR)1:23:57 – 1:24:43

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Director Gabbard, last year your agencies testified, and I quote, "Rand's large conventional forces are capable of inflicting substantial damage to an attacker, executing regional strikes." and disrupting shipping, particularly energy supplies, through the Strait of Hormuz. In other words, every problem we're seeing now was not only foreseeable, but was actually predicted by the intelligence agencies. So, Director, in the lead-up to the start of this war three weeks ago, did the intelligence agencies stick to their assessment that in response to an attack, the Iranians had the capability to shut down the Strait of Hormuz.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:24:46 – 1:24:58

Uh, thank you, Senator Wyden, the intelligence community has continued to provide the president and his team with the intelligence, uh, related to this operation in Iran, before and on an ongoing basis.

Sen. Wyden (OR)1:24:59 – 1:25:35

So, right now, we're in a global energy crisis. We're paying more for gas, the economy is in danger, And it seems to me, and I heard you discuss this with Senator Warner too, that there's a lot of hedging going on with respect to entirely foreseen consequences of the war. And that strikes me, Madam Director, as what amounts to a historic mistake. Now, my second question is, did the intelligence agencies assess that the Iranians could respond to a regime change attack from us by attacking US forces and other American and other Americans in the region?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:25:36 – 1:25:49

Um, the IC assessment has always taken very seriously, uh, the threat of the Iranian regime's missile capabilities and how uh our American troops within the region may be put at risk.

Sen. Wyden (OR)1:25:50 – 1:26:32

Again, you know, it seems to me with Americans dying in the war, it's hard to see how you can sit here and say that the intelligence agencies couldn't provide a clear warning, that if attacked, the Iranians would respond by attacking our people. Now on Monday, Madam Director, Donald Trump was asked about Iranian strikes on the Gulf States. He said, and I quote, "Nobody, nobody, no, no, no, the greatest experts, nobody thought they were gonna hit the Gulf States. You all are supposed to be the greatest experts. That's what we have you there for." Director Gabbard did the intelligence agencies assess that Iran could conduct strikes on our own partners in the region if it was attacked.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:26:33 – 1:26:45

Uh, the intelligence community has continued to assess uh the potential threats to the region the existing threats to the region and providing those assessments to, the policy makers and decision makers.

Sen. Wyden (OR)1:26:46 – 1:27:10

Let me move on to several others of you with respect to seven O two of FISA, and I'm just gonna start with you, General Hartman. When Congress last reauthorized section seven O two of FISA, it included a provision that expanded the type of companies and individuals who could be forced to assist the government in its spying. Has this expansion resulted in any intelligence, General Hartman?

William J. Hartman (Witness)1:27:11 – 1:27:26

Senator, thanks for the question. Uh, just to be clear, this provision provided us an a a an ability to collect foreign intelligence on personnel outside of the United States. Um.

Sen. Wyden (OR)1:27:26 – 1:27:32

Is the major seven O two issue in terms of expansion, what was the effect of what was done.

William J. Hartman (Witness)1:27:33 – 1:27:38

Uh, Senator, I would uh prefer to talk to you about exact specifics uh in the close session.

Sen. Wyden (OR)1:27:37 – 1:28:22

OK. I'm happy to do that. Let's understand, though, this is a dangerously broad provision that could be used to rope in anybody with access to a cable box, a WiFi router, or a server. It was jammed into the twenty twenty four reauthorization bill at the last minute. Senators were told they had no choice. but to support it. And now, two years later, we've just had testimony from a very respected individual who's saying, so far it has had no value. So, colleagues, we are getting ready to have another discussion on this, and this ought to be a warning to every senator that not every new spying power that is sold as urgent and critically and critical actually is.

William J. Hartman (Witness)1:28:22 – 1:28:24

Senator, could I please respond to that?

Sen. Wyden (OR)1:28:24 – 1:28:24

Of course.

William J. Hartman (Witness)1:28:25 – 1:28:37

So, so, Senator, I just wanna be clear. it provided us no additional authority that doesn't involve collecting intelligence on foreigners that are outside of the United States of America.

Sen. Wyden (OR)1:28:37 – 1:29:01

Fine. Director Patel, a question for you. In twenty twenty three, your predecessor testified that, and I quote, " to my knowledge, we do not currently purchase commercial database information that includes location data derived from internet advertising." Is that the case, t- still? And if so, can you commit this morning to not buying Americans' location data?

Kash Patel (Witness)1:29:02 – 1:29:22

Thank you. The FBI uses all tools, Senator, thank you for the question, to - to pr- do our mission. We do purchase, uh, commercially available information that's consistent with the Constitution and the laws, under the Electronic Communications Privacy Act. And it has led to some valuable intelligence for us to be utilized with our private and partner sectors.

Sen. Wyden (OR)1:29:23 – 1:30:09

So you're saying that the agency will buy Americans' location data. I believe that that's what you've said in kind of intelligence lingo, and I just wanna say, as we start this debate, doing that without a warrant is an outrageous end run around the Fourth Amendment. It's particularly dangerous given the use of artificial intelligence to comb through massive amounts of private information. This is exhibit A. for why Congress needs to pass our bipartisan, bicameral bill, the Government Surveillance Reform Act. I have time, I believe, for one more question, Director, uh, Patel, you three weeks ago, uh, indicated you were dissatisfied about having your phone records subpoenaed. Do you think the government ought to get a court order to collect phone records?

Kash Patel (Witness)1:30:10 – 1:30:16

Senator, in my experience, the government does r- get court orders to obtain, uh, phone records.

Sen. Wyden (OR)1:30:18 – 1:30:33

One last question. General Adams, for you, in twenty twenty one your agency confirmed that it had purchased and searched domestic location data. It is still your agency's position that you can buy Americans' location data without a warrant? And if so, are you still doing it?

James H. Adams III (Witness)1:30:34 – 1:30:48

Senator, thanks for the question. With regards to commercially available information and publicly available information, the purchases that this agency, that my agency makes, is in in alignment with the Constitution and protects US persons' information. So.

Sen. Wyden (OR)1:30:48 – 1:30:57

So, but you're buying location data, correct? I mean, we've now had that referred to twice and I don't think there's any question that you're doing it.

James H. Adams III (Witness)1:30:58 – 1:31:08

All of the purchases, purchasing of commercially available information by the agency is passed through legal channels and is in complete compliance with laws.

Sen. Wyden (OR)1:31:08 – 1:31:08

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Sen. Cotton (AR)1:31:09 – 1:31:25

General Hartman, I wanna give you a chance to answer more specifically what Senator Wyden said. You did answer it, uh, indirectly. Does anything in section seven O two give the government the authority to target any American with a cable box or a WiFi router.

William J. Hartman (Witness)1:31:27 – 1:31:34

Chairman, uh, nothing in seven O two gives us the authority to target an American with a cable router or a WiFi device.

Sen. Cotton (AR)1:31:34 – 1:32:10

Thank you. And I would observe about commercially available data, that the keywords are commercially available. If any other person can buy it, and the FBI can buy it, and it helps him locate a depraved child molester or savage cartel leader, I would certainly hope the FBI is doing anything they can to keep Americans safe. It's not much different from long-standing Supreme Court precedent that, for instance, says law enforcement can go through trash that you put on the side of the curb, because you no longer have a privacy interest in it. Senator Cornyn.

Sen. Cornyn (TX)1:32:12 – 1:32:50

Thank you all for your service to our country, uh you have our we are in debt to all of you. I wanna ask you Director Ratcliffe, uh yesterday uh the head of the National Counterterrorism Center resigned saying that Iran did not represent an imminent threat to the United States. Is there any anything to indicate that Iran had ceased in its nuclear ambitions or in its desire to continue to build ballistic missiles? capable of threatening uh, American troops and allies in the Middle East.

John Ratcliffe (Witness)1:32:52 – 1:32:55

Senator, no, in fact, the intelligence reflects the contrary.

Sen. Cornyn (TX)1:32:56 – 1:32:59

So, you disagree with uh, Mister Kent.

John Ratcliffe (Witness)1:33:00 – 1:33:00

I do.

Sen. Cornyn (TX)1:33:01 – 1:33:20

I would think uh, any fair-minded assessment of the situation, even based on open sources, would reflect the danger Iran poses, the regime poses to the United States. Isn't it true they've basically been at war with the West since nineteen seventy nine, during the Iranian revolution, and have American blood on their hands?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)1:33:20 – 1:33:31

That's absolutely correct. Uh, I think Iran has been a constant threat to the United States for an extended period of time, and and posed an immediate threat, um, uh, at this time.

Sen. Cornyn (TX)1:33:33 – 1:35:03

The, uh, threat assessment says that Al-Qaeda and ISIS maintain the intent to launch operations targeting the US, but it's most likely to occur through US-based loan offenders. I wanna ask you, Director Patel, um, it seems like there's been a a raft of incidents. Recently, um, on March the first in Austin, Texas, where I live, a lone gunman wearing a, uh, sweatshirt saying " property of Allah" and who, uh, the T-shirt he wore underneath had an Iranian flag uh, killed three innocent people and injured twelve more. Um, and then we know in, uh, in Virginia, the old Dominion shooting, um, uh, somebody who unbelievably was sentenced to eleven years in federal prison for attempting to support ISIS, but then was released only to commit another terrorist attack. We all are familiar with what's happened in Michigan, in New York, and, uh, I applaud the, uh, important role that the FBI has played in stopping some terrorist attacks, but obviously the FBI can't be everywhere all the time. Would you please talk about the, uh, your cooperation and collaboration with, uh, Homeland Security investigations in countering terrorist attacks against the United States?

Kash Patel (Witness)1:35:03 – 1:35:18

Thank you, Senator. Absolutely. essential that the FBI cooperates with the entire inter inter-agency. But as to your question about DHS specifically, what we have stood up around the country are fifty-nine homeland security task forces in fifty-nine separate locations.

Sen. Cornyn (TX)1:35:18 – 1:35:20

These are joint terrorism task forces.

Kash Patel (Witness)1:35:19 – 1:36:07

Essentially, the JTTF model was expanded so the the FBI owns fifty-six joint terrorism task forces in each of our field offices. On top of that, we have fifty s- fifty-nine H HSTFs, which are co-led by the FBI and DHS. And what that allows us to do is things like we did down in New Orleans, just uh over the holiday period where we surged for a six p week period of time, um and where we dropped the murder rate by double digit points, and also was the first time that Mardi Gras in its entire history had not one homicide. So when you bring the powers of the homeland security folks, DHS and the FBI together, this is the purpose of it, to get after not just the terrorism threat, but the violence and the criminal activity in our cities. And that's why we're in fifty-nine cities across the country. And it's working in places like Memphis and every other city we have it.

Sen. Cornyn (TX)1:36:08 – 1:36:16

Are you aware of the fact that, uh, Homeland Security investigation is a major directorate within Immigration and Customs Enforcement?

Kash Patel (Witness)1:36:16 – 1:36:17

Yes, sir. Yes, sir.

Sen. Cornyn (TX)1:36:18 – 1:36:38

And are you aware that, uh, Senate Democrats have uniformly voted not to fund the Department of Homeland Security, including uh, Homeland Security investigations, TSA, um, FEMA, and other functions of the, uh, Department of Homeland Security.

Kash Patel (Witness)1:36:38 – 1:36:43

Senator, I'm aware that, uh, employees of DHS are, uh, one month without pay.

Sen. Cornyn (TX)1:36:43 – 1:36:44

They're not being paid, right?

Kash Patel (Witness)1:36:44 – 1:36:44

Yes, sir.

Sen. Cornyn (TX)1:36:46 – 1:37:12

And, uh, we were all seeing the what's happening at airports, uh, where people are having to wait hours at a time because of the, uh, the fact that these, uh, TSA agents are overburdened. But what I wanted to, uh, focus on with you is is the refusal to fund the functions of the Department of Homeland Security, including homeland security investigations, making Americans less safe?

Kash Patel (Witness)1:37:12 – 1:37:13

Absolutely.

Sen. Cornyn (TX)1:37:21 – 1:38:03

So give us an example of some of the, uh, cooperation that, uh, you all have engaged in with, um, the FBI has engaged in with the homeland security investigations. I'm looking at a, at an article here that talks about the one hundred and ninety thousand Afghan nationals that were admitted to the United States, un- literally unvetted, uh, and, and there are examples of individuals, uh, within that, uh, one hundred and ninety thousand who have committed terrorist attacks against, uh, against the United States and against, uh, American citizens. Um, is that the sort of thing that, uh, you are investigating with HSI?

Kash Patel (Witness)1:38:03 – 1:38:08

Uh, Senator, that's one of the many things we're investigating with HSI, DHS, CBP, ICE.

Sen. Cornyn (TX)1:38:08 – 1:38:16

Give me some other examples of the collaboration on what other topics, including, uh, uh, in addition to, uh, terrorism attacks.

Kash Patel (Witness)1:38:16 – 1:39:32

What we're allowed to do with our DHS partners, Senator, is enable their, uh, massive workforce to supplement ours. And what they're allowed to do is share intelligence on what you just, things that you just talked about. about the hundred plus thousand um illegals that came in from afghanistan during the afghanistan withdrawal unfortunately they weren't vetted thoroughly so what we're doing is going back with our dhs partners and vetting absolutely every single one of them to the best that we can but unfortunately we're not able to go out into the country and find every single one of these individuals but we need uh more than uh twelve thousand fbi agents do that job which is why we are utilizing the hundred thousand uh or so eighteen elevens at the department of homeland security to give us the information they have from their immigration records from their travel records, from their travel logs overseas and within the country and what we're able to do is remove these individuals off the streets in every single state across the country to include violent gang members to include trend a ragua to include isis affiliated individuals to include al-qaeda related affiliated individuals, and hopefully we do it before um and not after, the tragedy that we witnessed in Washington DC, where an individual from Afghanistan was allowed to enter into our country, and shot multiple members of our uniformed military service.

Sen. King (ME)1:39:32 – 1:39:32

Thank you,

Sen. Cornyn (TX)1:39:32 – 1:39:33

Connor King.

Sen. King (ME)1:39:34 – 1:40:31

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, I I I do need to point out in response to some of the previous comments, uh twice in the last two weeks as recently as last Thursday, uh Senator Patty Patty Murray of the Appropriations Committee put a bill on the floor that would have fully funded TSA, FEMA, CISA and the Coast Guard for the rest of the year, leaving the focus on the dispute that we have with the conduct of of uh ICE uh as separately. So uh inexplicably to me, that bill was blocked uh by my Republican colleagues. It would have, as I say, fully funded uh TSA, FEMA, says that Coast Guard and then focused the the attention on uh the situation with ICE. So I just want to be clear on who's blocking funding for those uh four agencies um uh i'd like to ask uh uh ms. gabbert and and director Ratcliffe uh uh director both of you

John Ratcliffe (Witness)1:40:31 – 1:40:31

hear that

Sen. King (ME)1:40:31 – 1:40:54

uh were either of you in the room or your designees when the president was making was it a policy it's part of the original plan the final decision about uh uh taking this action against iran on february twenty seventh twenty eighth was there an intelligence committee uh intelligence uh community present in that, in those deliberations. Mister, Mister Radcliffe, your response?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)1:40:56 – 1:41:04

Uh, Senator King, I'm probably in dozens and dozens, uh, of briefings with the president, um, I don't know if there was a,

Sen. King (ME)1:41:04 – 1:41:05

Yeah, the

John Ratcliffe (Witness)1:41:04 – 1:41:08

uh, single meeting where there was a single time where a decision, uh,

Sen. King (ME)1:41:08 – 1:41:08

Were you,

John Ratcliffe (Witness)1:41:08 – 1:41:09

was made.

Sen. King (ME)1:41:08 – 1:41:14

were those, were those dozens of meetings right during the lead up to this, uh, to this, uh, war?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)1:41:14 – 1:41:15

Uh.

Sen. King (ME)1:41:16 – 1:41:22

I know you've met many times, but I'm talking about it in the two weeks or so before the decision to go into Iran was made.

John Ratcliffe (Witness)1:41:21 – 1:41:26

Yeah, again, uh, uh, countless meetings with with the president, um.

Sen. King (ME)1:41:26 – 1:41:27

During that period.

John Ratcliffe (Witness)1:41:28 – 1:41:29

During that period.

Sen. King (ME)1:41:30 – 1:41:33

Director Gabbard, you were you present in those discussions?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:41:33 – 1:41:35

Likewise, yes.

Sen. King (ME)1:41:35 – 1:42:07

The reason I'm asking the question is there seemed to be a discrepancy between what the intelligence committee ha uh community has reported over the years, and what the president has said in terms of his uh of this action. For example, Senator uh Wyden read the report from a year ago that strikes against neighboring states and uh action to close the Strait of Hormuz was predicted by the intelligence community and yet the president says nobody knew. And my question is, did you tell him? Anybody wanna answer that question?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)1:42:10 – 1:42:45

Um, Senator, I'll uh answer the question. So, um, with with regard to briefings, um, The the president gets briefings constantly about intelligence. Now, the comments that you talked about, uh, I had not heard, but what I can tell you is that, um, Iran had specific plans to hit US interests in, uh, energy sites across the region. Uh, and that's why the Department of War and the Department of State took measures for force protection and personnel protection, in advance of Operation Epic Fury. I think that's what's most important.

Sen. King (ME)1:42:46 – 1:42:58

Any, uh, any predictions to the president about the Strait of Hormuz? All you gotta do is look at a map and you'll see that the vulnerability of the Strait of Hormuz. Was that, was that part of the briefing, Sec uh, Director Gabbard?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:42:59 – 1:43:11

I think the Director Ratcliffe, uh, made the point here is that, uh, this has long been an assessment of the IC, uh, that Iran would likely hold the Strait of Hormuz as leverage.

Sen. King (ME)1:43:11 – 1:43:15

And, and my question is, was that communicated to the president in the lead up to this action?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:43:14 – 1:43:24

And, and it's because of that. long-standing assessment that the ic has continued to report that the department of war took the preemptive planning measures that it did

Sen. King (ME)1:43:25 – 1:43:37

Well, they've stated that they did not plan for the Strait of Hormuz. The president said who who knew that was gonna happen? Anyway, let's move on. Does the president take a a daily brief from the intelligence community?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)1:43:41 – 1:43:41

The

Sen. King (ME)1:43:41 – 1:43:43

This is a this is a yes or no question, I think.

John Ratcliffe (Witness)1:43:43 – 1:44:22

Yeah, the president, um, I would say, Senator, in my estimation on average, I brief the President of the United States on intelligence uh probably on average uh ten to fifteen times a week, where I have conversations with him about uh specific discrete issues. Sometimes uh there are dedicated sessions uh that last hours in length. Uh sometimes I'm briefing him on specific issues, sometimes three or four times a day. Uh, but I would say on average, uh, my interactions where I'm briefing the president on important national security matters uh happens probably on average ten to fifteen times per week.

Sen. King (ME)1:44:22 – 1:44:32

Thank you. Could you update us on uh the intelligence on Russian uh intelligence sharing with Iran in the current conflict? What what what do we know?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:44:33 – 1:44:42

Uh, Senator, if if there is that sharing going on, um, that would be a an answer that would be appropriate for a a closed Session.

Sen. King (ME)1:44:43 – 1:44:50

Well, it's been in the in the public press, uh, this is open source that it's occurring. Um, i- is it occurring?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:44:51 – 1:45:09

Again, uh, if it is occurring, that would be an answer, uh, appropriate for a closed session. Uh, what I can tell you is that according, um, to the Department of War, uh, any support that Iran may be receiving is not inhibiting their operational effects.

Sen. King (ME)1:45:10 – 1:45:28

OK, that's sort of the first cousin of a yes, I guess. Um. According to intelligence analysis, can regime change or the elimination of the estimated one thousand pounds of uh highly enriched uranium be accomplished without boots on the ground?

James H. Adams III (Witness)1:45:33 – 1:45:52

Uh, Senator, the um discussion about the iranian nuclear capability uh we intend in the closed session to talk about that in great deal with regards to uh revealing any information about the ability to do that um i i i would have to defer that to a closed session

Sen. King (ME)1:45:52 – 1:46:47

ok i'll see you in an hour um finally there was very little if anything in the in the uh report in the uh assessment about climate change and that's been in in past reports There is a lot of discussion about migration. The estimates are that climate migrants, because of the changes in the the climate and the and the atmosphere, and particularly in the center equatorial area of the earth, will range from two hundred million to a billion people by twenty fifty. Do you believe that is a national security threat that should be addressed? We the the Syrian refugees were about six million and they upset the politics of Europe for several years, we're talking about two hundred million to a billion people on the move. I believe that's something we should be discussing, and that the intelligence community should be assessing. Uh, Director Gabbard?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:46:48 – 1:47:01

Uh, yes, Senator, there are a number of drivers of things like migration. Uh, it would be an extensive and voluminous annual threat assessment if we included every single one. This annual threat assessment is focused, again,

Sen. King (ME)1:47:01 – 1:47:03

So you don't think uh, you don't think uh

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:47:01 – 1:47:09

on the priorities laid out. laid out by the President's national security strategy and on the effects

Sen. King (ME)1:47:04 – 1:47:04

So, so you

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)1:47:09 – 1:47:15

that we can take action, um, uh, operational action, uh, to protect US interests.

Sen. King (ME)1:47:15 – 1:47:19

Well, I would suggest combating climate change is something we can take action on. Thank you, Mister Chairman.

Sen. Cotton (AR)1:47:21 – 1:48:02

On the matter of media reports about Russian or Chinese collaboration with Iran, I would point out that the media is not a classification authority. And that kind of story, whether true or not, might be better suited for the FBI to investigate on whether there's been unlawful disclosures of classified information. I would also say, it sounds like something Russia and China would do. Communist Russia used to do it during the Cold War and Communist China has always done stuff like that. On the Patty Murray legislation, uh, not only would it have defunded ICE and CBP, it would have also defunded Homeland Security investigations, which do

Sen. Moran (KS)1:48:19 – 1:49:15

Chairman, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Um, I, I believe that, uh, it's in the US's national interest, our security interest, for Ukraine, to be successful in defeating the Russian invasion. I'm concerned with the consequences of Operation Epic Fury on that ability of Ukraine to succeed in defending its borders. And General Adams, in broad terms, not necessarily not not classified terms, what are the consequences to the supply chain, to the capability of the United States to supply NATO allies and Ukraine Um, as a result of Operation Epic Fury. Um, my question is uh, that usual problem of how do we do both, are we doing both, is US support maintained or diminished uh for Ukraine, uh, as a result of Epic Fury?

James H. Adams III (Witness)1:49:17 – 1:50:31

Uh, Senator, uh, thank you for the, that question and, and we do continue to uh, beyond Epic Fury, uh, observe what is happening, um, across the world in in crisis like uh russian ukraine uh unfortunately for um the situation there now just based on the force composition and the the delta between the russian forces and the ukrainian forces the advantage uh is to to the russians um as we get into the classified hearing we can talk a little more specifically about uh this the items with regards to the supply chain and and And uh and with regards to the the uh information that the Defense Intelligence Agency collects, we look at the foreign threat and what their capabilities are from a um multi-int uh perspective. Um we look a little bit less at at friendly capabilities. Now I would defer questions with regards to uh US supply chain uh limitations with regards to logistics and the e- effort that the Secretary of War is having with regards to trying to boost the US Defense Industrial Base. I would defer those to um the department uh to to discuss.

Sen. Moran (KS)1:50:32 – 1:51:08

Well, General, please be prepared uh for the classified session for me to continue to pursue this. I mean, I don't our supply chain issues are not classified in the sense that uh every hearing I'm in as a defense appropriator has officials from the Department of Defense testifying about the need for further assistance. And uh, really I'm asking for the the facts of what uh what has happened as a result of operation fury epic fury uh in the last few weeks in our uh our supply to ukraine and our nato allies who were supplying ukraine

James H. Adams III (Witness)1:51:10 – 1:51:24

uh yes sir the the um the department is uh executing a comprehensive uh in fact the second war has gone around the nation to boost uh the defense industrial base we know for a fact that that we have to increase our

Sen. Moran (KS)1:51:40 – 1:51:44

well uh i'm interested in helping accomplish that goal director ratcliff

James H. Adams III (Witness)1:51:41 – 1:51:41

yeah

Sen. Moran (KS)1:51:45 – 1:52:01

uh perhaps along along the same line um i assume among let me first of all compliment you on your public service i i Uh, and that's not my usual town hall meeting when I get a compliment from somebody who then follows it with a but. Uh,

James H. Adams III (Witness)1:52:02 – 1:52:02

Yeah.

Sen. Moran (KS)1:52:02 – 1:53:36

I am interested in being of help and I in in regard to your um, conversations in preparation for epic fury, uh, I'd be interested in knowing if the consequences to our abilities to defend the United States uh against Russia or China or other adversaries was taken into account, how was that diminished or increased by Operation Epic Fury, and particularly in this instance about what it means, uh, was the conversation had about what it means to our ability to help Ukraine defend itself. Um, US support for Ukraine, uh, includes military and other assistance, but also we've undertaken economic sanctions against Russia, uh, for their invasion of Ukraine. And epic fury has caused a significant increase in oil prices. And the administration has waived sanctions against Russian oil companies, um, and, which is reported to s- to say that Russia is receiving a hundred and fifty million dollars per day, additional, uh, dollars as a result of the waiver. What can you tell me about, um, our plans or uh your uh understanding of what's transpiring as a result of operation epic fury in regard to those oil revenues that are now being generated in favor of russia and the lifting of this of the sanctions at least for a temporary period of time

John Ratcliffe (Witness)1:53:37 – 1:56:08

uh senator thanks for the compliment i think um uh i'll i'll start with a couple of things what i what i would tell you is Um, the same military and intelligence professionals who delivered, uh, not just for the administration, but for the American people, um, a flawless intelligence picture and flawless military operations in Operation Midnight Hammer, and Operation Absolute Resolve, are the same folks involved with Operation Epic Fury. And so I hope that provides you some measure of comfort, uh, with regard to how detailed, how thoughtful, uh, the approach was to, uh, the current operation. Uh, uh, and that's why I think that to, to mischaracterize it as it is being done in the media is a disservice to, to the folks involved in what is, uh, a very specific campaign that is different than the two that I mentioned before. It's why the president came out and said, this isn't over in a matter of hours, this is a four to six week campaign, um, and that it would come at some cost. Um, because the, the goal of the president and the administration is to address a forty-seven year problem, the most destabilizing force in the Middle East for the last forty-seven years, one that has frankly, um, been, uh, watered, fed, and nurtured by, uh, uh, policies of prior administrations that has allowed them to become the threat that they have. So I say all of that sort of in context to understanding that, uh, we have to address that, but at the same time to your point on on the what's going on with regard to Russia and Ukraine and you mentioned the oil uh issue. Sometimes policymakers um have to take steps that while they may benefit adversaries, like Russia or China, uh do so because they also think it will benefit um US citizens, in in this case with respect to keeping uh the economy uh, on track in keeping oil prices low. So what I can tell you is, uh, the intelligence is thoughtfully considered, and I think the policymakers have taken that, um, and, uh, are, I am confident that we can walk and chew gum at the same time, uh, uh, pursue objectives in the Middle East and, uh, provide support, uh, with regard to the conflict in Russia and, uh, the, the Russian aggression in Ukraine.

Sen. Bennet (CO)1:56:09 – 2:01:11

Senator Bennett. Thank you, Mister Chairman, I appreciate that. Mister, uh, Director Ratcliffe, just, you just described the, the specific campaign that the President is engaged in, the country he's engaged in, with respect to Iran. I think the, the campaign has been won, in my view, without a specific rationale for the American people. Ninety days into President Trump's unauthorized war with Iran, And by which I mean, there has been no congressional approval, at least thirteen American service members are dead, and many others are injured. Yet President Trump has offered no credible justification for the, an imminent threat, no clear goals, no strategy or time-line. His message keeps changing, I think, in really damaging ways. President Trump said Iran's nuclear facilities had been quote, totally obliterated, in June, twenty twenty five, but when he launched this latest war, he said we need to eliminate the imminent nuclear threat of those totally obliterated nuclear facilities. President Trump has threatened to seize Iranian oil and demanded our allies reopen the Strait of Herm or Moos, he said that, I'm demanding that these countries come in and protect their own territory, because it's their territory, it's the place from which they get their energy. By the way, he wasn't just asking for our allies to protect or to to to bail them out in the, in the Straits of Hormuz. He was asking China to bail them out in the Straits of Hormuz. And then he said, maybe we shouldn't even be here at all because we don't need it, we have a lot of oil. And he said, we do not need the help of anyone. President Trump has declared, we've won the war. We won it in the first hour. But then he said, we're not leaving until the job is finished. He said that there is practically nothing left to bomb, but then threatened to bomb Iran again, quote, just for fun. I think words that probably have never come out of a military leader in the history of the United States of America. It shouldn't come out of the mouth of a civilian leader. President Trump said he will end the war when I feel it, feel it in my bones. And any time I wanna end it, it will end. But, Director, the war is not ending, it is escalating with thousands of US Marines reportedly sailing toward Iran on an unclear mission, a mission that's become less clear over days, not more clear. Our airstrikes wi- wiped out Iran's missiles and Supreme Leader. Nobody here, and certainly me, is shedding a tear for him. But the Iranian people now live under martial law, and the, by the way, no surprise to our intelligence agencies that that's the case. And the fir and a and the and the first of a puppet leader who's chosen by the IR IRGC, no surprise that anyb- on to anybody on the intelligence committee. Iran closed the Strait of Hormuz and is holding the global economy hostage, no surprise to anybody who knows anything about US intelligence, launching drones at our embassies and military bases. No surprise, the President is surprised, nobody who has looked at our intelligence is surprised. Iran's nuclear program is damaged, to be sure, but it still has a Ura- uranium stockpile. We heard today from the DNI at the very beginning of this conversation that the regime is in place and they are gonna rebuild their military capabilities, the ones that we are destroying right now. The question I think is raised, Director, about your specific engagement is whether it will become a perpetual war, because what Iran will do is exactly what they have always done. And which the DNI is saying they will do again. In its briefings to the committee, the intelligence committee has been clear-eyed about what would happen in the Straits. of horn moves, has been clear-eyed about uh whether or not our military bases, our embassies, and our and our and our personnel in the region would be placed at risk and in harm's way, even though the administration did very little to protect them. I know, Senator, I know, Director Radcliffe, that I am that you warned President Trump that if that if Israel assassinated the Supreme Leader the RRGC would replace him with with potentially a hard-line puppet. In fact, in fact, I think what was clear is that the likelihood was that it would be a hard-line puppet. Do you disagree with that characterization of the intelligence?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:01:13 – 2:01:27

To that specific question, um, what we knew was, uh, first of all, I guess I have to address up front, um, so much of what you related in there the difference between political rhetoric versus

Sen. Bennet (CO)2:01:27 – 2:01:30

it's not political rhetoric i'm quoting the president of the united states

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:01:30 – 2:01:33

political rhetoric versus military between

Sen. Bennet (CO)2:01:30 – 2:01:35

that's i'm director i'll i'll i'll i'll i'll i'll ask you

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:01:34 – 2:01:49

milit the difference between that and military and intelligence execution but here's the most important thing you mischaracterize this as saying there aren't clearly defined goals the defined goals are very clear degrade and destroy the missile inventory and drone inventory delay and

Sen. Bennet (CO)2:01:44 – 2:01:49

no i said i said right we've done that

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:01:49 – 2:01:52

and and degrade the military industrial base

Sen. Bennet (CO)2:01:50 – 2:01:53

right i i

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:01:53 – 2:01:54

and batteries that produce that,

Sen. Bennet (CO)2:01:53 – 2:01:53

Mister

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:01:55 – 2:02:00

degrade and destroy the the the IRGC navy that could control the strain.

Sen. Bennet (CO)2:01:55 – 2:02:00

Director, I have no doubt, Director, thank you.

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:02:00 – 2:02:03

These are all defined goals that were that were set out specifically.

Sen. Bennet (CO)2:02:00 – 2:02:03

OK, I appreciate, Director, I don't

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:02:04 – 2:02:06

But you the the premise of the question is that

Sen. Bennet (CO)2:02:04 – 2:02:14

I May I have my time back, Mister Chairman, I can't get a word in edgewise. He won't answer the question and then he's taken a minute of my time. I

Sen. Cotton (AR)2:02:13 – 2:02:16

You're you're both big boys, you can handle it yourselves there,

Sen. Bennet (CO)2:02:16 – 2:02:16

OK, well,

Sen. Cotton (AR)2:02:16 – 2:02:16

man.

Sen. Bennet (CO)2:02:16 – 2:02:30

Director, I agree that you are, and I appreciate what you're saying, and And I would, I'm not My my point is not what your characterization of the war is. My point is what the character is,

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:02:30 – 2:02:30

Your

Sen. Bennet (CO)2:02:30 – 2:02:33

the demandor commander change I'm not asking you anymore,

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:02:31 – 2:02:32

your question about regime change

Sen. Bennet (CO)2:02:33 – 2:02:34

Mister Director.

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:02:34 – 2:02:34

OK.

Sen. Bennet (CO)2:02:34 – 2:03:37

I'm sorry because I'm out of time because of how you use the time. The complete lack of clarity should matter to everybody. President Trump, most of all, he is the person that got elected on the criticism. that we had we had fought two wars in the Middle East that had lasted for twenty years. And now we're hearing the testimony is to get their ballistic missiles, to to not even get to the nuclear stuff, we're gonna have to be in a perpetual war with Iran. And I don't think that's where the American people are on this. This is a serious threat. This is a serious threat to us and to Israel. The question is how to handle it. And President Trump said, we are not the policemen of the world. He ran on that. And now he's turned us into the world's policeman, into its jur jury, into its judge, into its executioner. And just because we have the most advanced military in the world,

Sen. Cotton (AR)2:03:37 – 2:03:40

Senator Times has, Senator Times has has expired.

Sen. Bennet (CO)2:03:37 – 2:03:43

it doesn't mean that we should be in a perpetual war all around the world.

Sen. Cotton (AR)2:03:40 – 2:03:42

Senator Bennett, your time has expired.

Sen. Bennet (CO)2:03:43 – 2:03:44

Thank you, Mister Chairman.

Sen. Cotton (AR)2:03:43 – 2:03:45

Se- Senator Rounds.

Sen. Rounds (SD)2:03:46 – 2:04:44

Th- thank you, Mister, Mister Chairman. Um, I'd like to maybe follow up a little bit. The same line of questioning, but I wanna do it in a little bit different manner. Um, uh, I I've had the opportunity, like all of the other members on this committee, to see the threats that we discuss regularly in the classified settings. Uh, I also, sitting on the Armed Services Committee, have the opportunity to see what our capabilities are and uh, what we have to do in order to respond to those threats. Uh, Director Ratcliffe, let me just begin. I I think it's been very clear from the beginning that even though there were, supposedly diplomatic activities going on, behind the scenes it was very clear, and I just ask if you would disagree or agree with me on this. It was very clear that Iran, while they were talking, they had no intentions of following through diplomatically with eliminating any of their nuclear uh aspirations. Correct?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:04:44 – 2:04:57

Uh, Senator, that's uh, that's correct, and in the classified s session we can go into detail, but you've characterized it right. Diplomatically they were saying one thing, uh, the intelligence was reflecting quite the contrary.

Sen. Rounds (SD)2:04:57 – 2:05:11

OK. Second of all, with regard to the capabilities, earlier in the twelve day war, a lot of their defensive capabilities had been taken out. Their air defenses had been cap had been taken out. Uh, the use of our

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:05:31 – 2:06:30

Uh, yes. So, uh, uh, I'll just comment on that, that so much is being made. Uh, any characterization that, uh, Operation Midnight Hammer was anything but a wild success is, uh, wildly inaccurate. Um, uh, so, uh, as a result of Operation Midnight Hammer, uh, at the time of that, uh, in the in the preceding four years as is well documented, uh, and admitted to by the Iranians, they, um, enriched uranium at least four hundred and forty kilograms at sixty percent, uh, for use that could be used, uh, uh, for weapons grade to deliver a nuclear weapon. Um, as a result of Operation Midnight Hammer, uh, we sit here today with, uh, Iran having exactly the same amount of enriched uranium to sixty percent, meaning they have been unwilling and incapable or incapable of enriching uranium to sixty percent as a result of Operation Midnight Hammer.

Sen. Rounds (SD)2:06:31 – 2:06:51

OK, uh, and let me go on because I think this is an important part of this. You also have to have a way of delivering a weapon. it's fair to say that they have short-term and intermediate range ballistic missile availability today. Were they building additional short-range and mid-range, uh, uh, ballistic missiles?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:06:52 – 2:06:54

Yes, uh, and

Sen. Rounds (SD)2:06:53 – 2:06:55

Were they continuing to develop them?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:06:55 – 2:07:00

Continuing to develop them and at and at rates that were, uh, alarming.

Sen. Rounds (SD)2:07:00 – 2:07:17

And what about our ability to respond to those? We have very good defensive capabilities, but it takes time for us to build our defensive capabilities. Were they building their offensive capabilities while they were negotiating with us at a faster rate than we could build defensive capabilities?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:07:18 – 2:07:18

Yes.

Sen. Rounds (SD)2:07:20 – 2:07:28

Were they continuing to work at and deliver additional resources to terrorist organizations that were affiliated with them in the region?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:07:29 – 2:07:29

Yes.

Sen. Rounds (SD)2:07:30 – 2:08:23

So in other words, while they were supposedly diplomatically working with us during that entire time, They were continuing uh with regard to their nuclear intentions. They were building additional missile systems to deliver or conventional weapon systems to threaten their neighbors. Their defensive capabilities were gonna be increased, making our young men and women at risk when at some point in the future, we would have to to basically go in and clean the mess up. I think there was an opportunity here, and I think the president made the right choice. We need decided at this time that simply for our advantage and for the young men and women that have to go in and do this, that this was a safer time, if there ever is such a thing as a safer time, but the right time for our nation to respond to this threat. Is that an appropriate way of putting it, sir?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:08:24 – 2:08:25

Uh, I agree with that.

Sen. Rounds (SD)2:08:25 – 2:09:25

Thank you. I think the president made the right choice. It is never a good time for a war. But at some point you've gotta look at what your best possibilities are, for protecting those young men and women who are in harm's way. Let me move on for just a minute. Um, D- Director Ratcliffe, let me just ask you this, because there's been a discussion, uh, and we've never been able to talk about this in an unclassified setting, and I recognize it's sensitive, but sixty minutes, there's been a report about Havana syndrome and about uh individuals who are within the agency and within the state departments that have actually had significant illnesses, some attributed they believe to outside uh uh sources. I don't think we have we have been able to, in an unclassified setting, at least acknowledge that we take these issues seriously. Is there anything you can share in this unclassified setting to assure the people of the State Department and your agency that this is not something which is being ignored?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:09:26 – 2:09:54

Uh, thanks for the question. I can. I appreciate the the opportunity to uh to address that. Um, yes, we have to be careful about um uh what we can say and we can go into further detail in the classified uh uh session. But uh this is something that when when I became the director, uh as you're a as you're aware, Senator, there are disparate opinions across the IC uh about what the cause of these AHI's may or may not be.

Sen. Rounds (SD)2:09:54 – 2:09:56

But otherwise known as Havana syndrome.

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:09:54 – 2:09:59

And Well Havana syndrome, yeah, or uh. And,

Sen. Rounds (SD)2:09:59 – 2:09:59

NHI.

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:09:59 – 2:10:33

and the question of whether or not, um, they could be the result of a, a directed energy weapon from a foreign adversary. So, when you, having been the DNI, understanding the role of the DNI is to coordinate across the IC. When there are disparate opinions among agencies, Director Gabbert and I had a conversation, um, where she agreed that she would undertake, uh, a comprehensive review, uh, of that issue across the IC to make sure that it is getting the attention that it And I know that she has undertaken that and will be able to to brief you in uh further detail in a classified session.

Sen. Rounds (SD)2:10:33 – 2:10:55

Thank you. And and one last thought, this is only a comment, but to General Hartman, um, your time in service has been very, very special. Working with you on the cyber uh security subcommittee, the armed services committee, I commend you for everything you have done. You are truly a hero. And uh, you have served your country very, very well. Thank you for your service.

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:10:55 – 2:10:56

Thank you, Senator.

Sen. Rounds (SD)2:10:56 – 2:10:57

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Sen. Cotton (AR)2:10:58 – 2:10:59

Senator Kelly.

Sen. Kelly (AZ)2:10:59 – 2:11:49

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you for, uh, being here today to all of our, our witnesses. So, for more than a decade, the United States has tried to make a pivot to Asia in its national defense strategy in order to confront significant threats from China. For years, administrations of both parties have identified China as a top threat facing our country and worked to build relationships across Asia and deter Chinese aggression. At the same time, we have bolstered our European allies and asked them to contribute more to their defense, to deter Russia. Director, Directors Gabbard and Ratcliffe, would you agree that China and Russia are our primary geopolitical rivals? Director Gabbard.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:11:51 – 2:11:54

Yes, they are our primary strategic competitors.

Sen. Kelly (AZ)2:11:53 – 2:11:56

Thank you. To record Ratcliffe?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:11:56 – 2:12:00

Uh, I would agree with that, although I don't think they're equal in terms of the threats that they pose.

Sen. Kelly (AZ)2:12:00 – 2:12:24

Understand. Thank you. So that brings us to the war with Iran. So this has created one of the largest ever supply shocks to the global oil supply, which has sent gas prices skyrocketing for Americans. But not everybody is losing. Directors Gabbard and Ratcliffe, is it accurate that Russia has gained billions of dollars in additional oil revenue

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:12:35 – 2:12:42

Uh, that is what has been reported, I defer to the director of uh uh secretary of treasury and energy on that front for details.

Sen. Kelly (AZ)2:12:43 – 2:12:44

Director Ratcliffe.

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:12:45 – 2:12:58

Yeah, uh, not an economist, not gonna uh try and do those calculations. But as I talked about earlier, sometimes there are decisions made that will benefit adversaries at the same time policymakers think that it will benefit the American people.

Sen. Kelly (AZ)2:12:56 – 2:13:15

Sanctions. It's clear, I think we'd all agree that sanctions were loosened, and that means more money into the coffers of Vladimir Putin. Uh, would you agree that if he has more funding, he is likely to put that to his war effort against Ukraine? Director Gabbard.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:13:18 – 2:13:23

Uh, I would defer to an uh actual intelligence assessment on what they would believe his intentions are.

Sen. Kelly (AZ)2:13:25 – 2:13:26

Director Ratcliffe?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:13:27 – 2:13:28

Yeah, I wouldn't speculate on that.

Sen. Kelly (AZ)2:13:27 – 2:13:45

Yeah. Wouldn't speculate? OK. OK. And is it accurate that China is continuing to receive preferential oil flows from Iran despite the conflict as Iran allows its own tankers to transit the Strait? Director Gabbard? I'm gonna go back and forth between the two of you.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:13:48 – 2:14:01

There has been some reporting of uh, China, India and other countries, uh, being able to move their tankers through the strait. However, uh, it is unclear the volume or the measure of that.

Sen. Kelly (AZ)2:14:01 – 2:14:19

OK, so it sounds like it's accurate. Thank you. I'm gonna move on. Director Gabbard, you tweeted yesterday that President Trump concluded there was an imminent threat and made a decision to attack Iran after carefully reviewing all of the information before him. I think the country deserves to know

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:14:43 – 2:14:48

Uh, I'm I'm not gonna comment on what the president did or didn't ask me. Uh, I'm I'm not gonna comment on what the president did or did not ask me. On any topic.

Sen. Kelly (AZ)2:14:48 – 2:14:52

I'm not even, I'm not asking if you have briefed it. I'm just asking if there was a request

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:14:52 – 2:14:53

I I understand that.

Sen. Kelly (AZ)2:14:53 – 2:15:02

by the White House. Director Ratcliffe. Were you asked to brief on whether Iran would close the Strait of Hormuz?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:15:03 – 2:15:15

The the briefings to the to the president of the White House typically don't come at the request of the White House. So, typically when we get intelligence that we want the president to be aware of the intelligence community brings that to To the president.

Sen. Kelly (AZ)2:15:15 – 2:15:19

Did you produce the analysis for the Straits of Hormuz?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:15:19 – 2:15:22

There has been and continues to be analysis with respect to that.

Sen. Kelly (AZ)2:15:22 – 2:15:58

Were you asked a brief on how our adversaries and allies would respond to the war in Iran? I imagine I'll get the same answer. So, it's, just to point out here, it's challenging to forget about actually what was in the brief for a second. We're having a hard time finding out Not only if you briefed the president on something, but even if the White House asked if they could be briefed on something, or if analysis was produced. So, I just wanna point out here, this is about six days.

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:15:58 – 2:16:00

But I can I comment on that?

Sen. Kelly (AZ)2:16:00 – 2:16:00

Yes.

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:16:00 – 2:16:02

I'm I I go I go back to the point.

Sen. Kelly (AZ)2:16:01 – 2:16:01

Yes.

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:16:03 – 2:16:22

It it's the same approach that we took to the to to the prior operations, which to to your credit, Senator, you you have uh praised the intelligence and military communities in Operation Midnight Hammer and, uh, Operation Absolute Resolve, it's the same approach and the same professionals in terms of how they approached this particular operation.

Sen. Kelly (AZ)2:16:21 – 2:17:30

Yeah. But we're trying we're trying to we're trying to figure out if the president knew what the downside was of the Strait of Hormuz being closed. And I'm having a hard time finding out whether the White House asked or whether there was a brief whether the president knew did he know this was gonna happen? Or did he just disregard it? And I just wanna point out something that was released about six days ago. This is a fundraising email from the president, from the president of the United States. And in this email here, where there's multiple links to donate money, it says, as a national security briefing member, you'll receive my private national security briefings. Director Gabbard or Director Radcliffe, do you think the public should be able to, supporters of the president should be able to pay and receive his private national security briefings? I assume these are briefings, Director Radcliffe, that you provide to the president, that is now gonna be provided to somebody who makes a donation.

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:17:29 – 2:17:36

Regardless of what that, that, I don't know what that document is, um, but regardless of what it says, it, it didn't happen. Um,

Sen. Kelly (AZ)2:17:35 – 2:17:36

Well, no, this is new.

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:17:37 – 2:17:46

well, but what I'm telling you is that, uh, the Hatch Act would prevent me from, in a political role, from engaging in that. I'm not aware that anything like that happened.

Sen. Kelly (AZ)2:17:46 – 2:18:01

Yeah, this says unfiltered updates. So, Director Gabbert, do you have any comment on whether unfiltered updates of private national security briefings should be made to individuals, that donate to the president?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:18:01 – 2:18:04

I'm not, I'm not familiar with that document. And, uh,

Sen. Kelly (AZ)2:18:05 – 2:18:18

It's, it's been made very public six days ago. I, we'll, we'll get you a copy here because I agree with you, Director Rek, Director Ratcliffe, that the Hatch Act should prohibit this type of conduct. Thank you.

Sen. Cotton (AR)2:18:19 – 2:18:24

Senator Lankford joins us from what I gather is a very exciting confirmation hearing for Senator Mullen.

Sen. Lankford (OK)2:18:24 – 2:20:27

It is actually. For all of you, thank you. Thank you for the time that you give to the country to be able to serve, for your families and the sacrifice that you make to be able to do this, and all the professionals that work around you. Please pass on our gratitude to them because they work incredibly hard and difficult tasks in this. Uh, I I wanna talk about something that's a little closer to home on this. Um, a a lot of Oklahomans that I've talked to and quite frankly, folks even outside the state on it, when they think about threats, they, as strange as this may sound to those of us that deal with missiles and and ballistics, they think about the threat to their family and to their income and to who they are. And a lot of it is international scammers. that are now reaching into the United States to be able to gather data or to be able to steal money from them. Uh, AI has accelerated this dramatically and I know the worldwide threats has has mentioned this and some of the challenges that we face on it, but the challenge is getting bigger. Uh, FBI had noted that in twenty twenty four, uh, it was almost seventeen billion dollars that was assumed lost, uh, to scammers, a lot of those internationals, some estimates are as high as fifty billion dollars on it. Uh, AI continues to be able to accelerate the capabilities on it. OpenAI even uh noted uh now that there is a, uh they're putting online ads saying, if you've been scammed, here's a way to recover your money. And that is actually a scam. It's taken them to an fake FBI page, where they can then turn in and to say, if you've been scammed, here's how the FBI is gonna actually come help you to recover it. But even that page is fake, and they're going to be able to steal their information. This is accelerating at a pace that's pretty dramatic with the use of AI on this. Uh, Director Patel, I I know that you guys are on it. I know that there's multiple entities on it, but this is a big challenge. And a lot of Americans are very, very concerned about the threat to their families. They may have, uh, their parents, uh, that are more vulnerable at this time in being targeted. How do we take some of this on to be able to confront what's happening online, to be able to attack people and to be able to scam them?

Kash Patel (Witness)2:20:27 – 2:21:15

Thank you, Senator. And it's, with any other, um, high priority, um, operation that the FBI runs, whether it's CICT or we're talking about scamming and scam centers here, one, you have to drown and get online with your online covert employees and platforms. And we've increased funding and we've also, what we've done strategically is move people out of Washington, D. C. on the Intel analyst front and the support staff front to places like Oklahoma. Actually, every single state across the country has received a plus up because of that. And what we've created is the um, Internet Crime Complaint Center, the IC three, and which I know you're familiar with and reference. So what we're doing on the homeland is going out into the streets of America, on the online platforms in America, and shutting down those networks and shutting down the capability of AI to interfere. But I think the bigger term project, what we're doing overseas, that's the key to this.

Sen. Lankford (OK)2:21:15 – 2:21:15

Right.

Kash Patel (Witness)2:21:16 – 2:22:03

The scam center compounds are largely located in Cambodia and Burma and on the Thai border. I've already engaged with the premiers of each and every one of those countries. we've done so to switch off access to the internet um with those governments to make sure that those compounds or literal compounds that are being built we can get into that in the classified center that are fleecing americans and senior citizens all the way from southeast asia because they are backed by the ccp to build those compounds because they know it's gonna hurt everyday american so us which we have successfully already eliminated and scuttled excuse me numerous compounds in cambodia and birmingham and thailand is the big picture, the big part of the lift overseas, what what we're gonna do is go in to those countries and shut down every single scam center compound.

Sen. Lankford (OK)2:22:04 – 2:22:23

Uh, which is very helpful, and every American is is thinking about this and talking about it. Uh, Director Patel, I'm gonna stay with you, the counter-narcotics work has been phenomenal, uh, in the past year and a half. Uh, the amount of methamphetamine and fentanyl, uh, that had been seized, uh, coming across our border has been dramatic, uh, and that has a real effect.

Kash Patel (Witness)2:22:36 – 2:23:49

Absolutely, Senator, the the counter-narcotic mission can't be complete without state and local law enforcement. So we are embedding more task force officers across the country on the specific counter-narcotics mission. We've also stood up with our inter-agency partners, um, in Tucson, Arizona. the southern border intelligence center, specifically on the counter-narcotic mission, so that we can utilize the department of war and inter-agency capabilities on the law enforcement front. That's why we seized enough fentanyl in twenty twenty five to kill a hundred and seventy eight million Americans that's a thirty one percent increase year over year and here's a statistic that everybody should be proud of. Opioid overdose deaths from last year dropped twenty points, twenty points from across the country. And in Oklahoma specifically, Senator, we seized enough, uh kilograms of cocaine uh to include a two hundred and thirty two percent increase in the state of oklahoma alone and enough fentanyl to kill five hundred thousand oklahomans we can't do that unless we have great police partnerships which has been a priority of mine which i that's why i have embedded police officers here at headquarters from around the country to make sure we have that connectivity and i have shortened the task force officer onboarding pipeline from one to two years to ninety days We need them.

Sen. Lankford (OK)2:23:49 – 2:24:29

Yeah, we do. Director Ratcliffe, uh, the annual, uh, threat assessment highlights this year, uh, the Muslim Brotherhood, in particular, um, and calls out some of their financial material supports on this. Uh, that that may be surprising to some folks here, uh, but it's not surprising to folks all across the Middle East, uh, in the threat that the Muslim Brotherhood continues to pose, uh, to so many governments and entities across the world on that. How is the Muslim Brotherhood financing uh, itself, uh, and its acts of terrorism? Um, and is there something that we need to do here to be able to make sure that we're protecting Americans in the threat?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:24:32 – 2:24:57

Um, Senator, I think, uh, uh, w- with regard to the Muslim Brotherhood abroad, um, you know, we view that, uh, just as we do other proxies, um, across, uh, the Middle East. um, the Houthis and other, uh, other groups. And I can relate to you that the, the CIA is, is very focused, um, on the counterterrorism front. You weren't here before.

Sen. Lankford (OK)2:24:57 – 2:24:57

Right.

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:24:57 – 2:25:45

Um, I said in the classified portion I would get into, uh, uh, the CIA's success with regard to groups like the Muslim Brotherhood in a classified setting, where I can, um, I can share with you the, uh, the impact that we're having. But what I, what I, and and across the board with regard to uh uh terrorist groups and our counterterrorism activities I can publicly characterize it as saying um we've had we've we've accomplished more in the last year than in the four years of the prior administration combined. Um so hopefully it gives you some measure of comfort about about how we're approaching things and the the effectiveness that we've had in the in the last uh year in that regard, and and I look forward to getting into detail in the classified portion.

Sen. Lankford (OK)2:25:45 – 2:25:46

Look forward to that. Thank you.

Sen. Cotton (AR)2:25:46 – 2:25:47

Senator Reid.

Sen. Reed (RI)2:25:48 – 2:26:16

Thanks very much, Mr. Chairman. Uh, ladies and gentlemen, thank you. Uh, the Washington Post reported earlier this week in their words, the US intelligent assessments say Iran's regime likely will remain in place for now, weakened but more hard-line, with the powerful Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps security forces exerting greater control. Director Gabbard, uh, do you stand by that, uh, reported intelligence community assessment?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:26:17 – 2:26:40

I don't stand by any, uh, leaked so-called intelligence to the media. Uh, I do stand by the intelligence community's assessment that was included in the annual threat assessment. That speaks directly to this issue that as of this moment, uh, the regime maintains power, uh, within Iran, uh, even though they are vastly degraded, on almost every front.

Sen. Reed (RI)2:26:41 – 2:26:54

Do you think that the, uh, killing of the Ayatollah and his wife and other, uh, family members and key people contributed to the picking of a hotline successor?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:26:56 – 2:27:18

Uh, Senator, the the intelligence community's assessment, um, has pointed to, uh, a number of different scenarios. um that uh went into play with the selection of the successor um the details of that we can discuss uh in a closed hearing with regard to the intelligence reporting.

Sen. Reed (RI)2:27:19 – 2:27:38

Is the uh uh regime in uh Iran now trying to um promote the deceased Ayatollah as a martyr uh who should be followed and does that help them consolidate uh, support.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:27:40 – 2:27:52

Uh, Senator, the Iranians are certainly using that as a call to action. Uh, the effects of that um from an intelligence standpoint uh are remain to be seen.

Sen. Reed (RI)2:27:53 – 2:28:04

There is a tradition in Shia, though, to honor martyrs, one of their greatest celebrations is the the martyrdom of uh um the grandson of Mohammed, is that correct?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:28:04 – 2:28:04

That's right.

Sen. Reed (RI)2:28:05 – 2:28:24

that we might have played into their cultural biases erroneously. Uh, General Adams, what conditions do you assess would need to be present to make the regime collapse or necessite necessitate, excuse my voice, unconditional surrender, and can it be done with air power alone?

James H. Adams III (Witness)2:28:27 – 2:29:05

Uh, Senator, we have at the Defense Intelligence Agency put together a number of um scenarios coordinated across the ic with regards to what we would forecast uh the the future would be the one of the the there are four specific goals that we've been uh told to uh to track and analyze with regards to the the goals of the us uh effort um they've been articulated uh earlier in the hearing so i won't hammer on those but with regards to the collapse of the regime specific uh perpetuation like what what would precipitate that um we we would like to i would prefer to talk about that in the uh classified hearing

Sen. Reed (RI)2:29:06 – 2:29:32

uh well uh i understand but there's a very basic question here will air power alone be able to destroy this regime giving the culture the politics the temperament of these people uh the iraq iran war lasted for eight years with a million casualties um Do you think your power alone will do it?

James H. Adams III (Witness)2:29:36 – 2:29:57

Senator, the capabilities that our joint force brings to bear, uh, ca- can accomplish many missions. To forecast exactly what can and can't, uh, accomplish this goal, um, I would, uh, prefer not to, uh, to, to guess or, uh, prognosticate on that.

Sen. Reed (RI)2:30:00 – 2:30:21

uh i'll recognize your professional uh position um us special envoy steve whitcough recently stated that russian leaders told trump on a call that they were not sharing intelligence with iran whitcough says quote we can take them at their word uh director gabbert and radcliffe do you take president putin at his word

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:30:24 – 2:30:31

uh i'll go ahead and answer um No, I don't take uh uh Vladimir Putin uh at his word. Um.

Sen. Reed (RI)2:30:33 – 2:30:36

Uh, are they providing intelligence to the Iranians?

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:30:37 – 2:30:38

Well, we talked about this before.

Sen. Reed (RI)2:30:38 – 2:30:39

Yes, sir.

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:30:38 – 2:31:02

Uh, the the uh in the classified session what we'll go what we can go into is that the Iranians are requesting intelligence uh assistance from Russia, from China, uh, and from other adversaries of the United States and whether and uh whether or not those countries are uh is something we can talk about in the classified portion.

Sen. Reed (RI)2:31:03 – 2:31:09

uh but you've made an assessment uh you've analyzed traffic uh communications and you can

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:31:09 – 2:31:13

i know the answer and happy to to discuss that with you in the classified portion.

Sen. Reed (RI)2:31:13 – 2:31:15

uh you

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:31:14 – 2:31:15

uh

Sen. Reed (RI)2:31:15 – 2:31:16

yes sir go ahead

John Ratcliffe (Witness)2:31:17 – 2:31:18

go ahead.

Sen. Reed (RI)2:31:18 – 2:32:11

thank you uh one of the aspects of this is the collateral effects particularly you know russia and ukraine uh we were just talking about russia probably or possibly providing intelligence we may be interfering or inflicting casualties on our forces uh russia is also benefiting from the uh lifting of sanctions on their ability to sell oil throughout the world uh i heard one estimate of a twenty billion dollar surge in their potential revenues uh ukraine on the other hand uh is facing perhaps a uh disrupted supply chain of missiles and other equipment because they're being devoted to this operation so uh general adams can you just give me a uh your impression of the effect of the battle on russia and ukraine at the moment of this battle

James H. Adams III (Witness)2:32:13 – 2:33:18

well from our uh collections um the effect of the uh uh epic fury on um the the russian uh ukrainian um uh battle um has been indirect uh not not direct um we do uh track very carefully what uh what benefits or uh as you uh alluded to uh the the collateral effects of what we're doing and how it how it impacts um there there is uh a lot of from both the russians and the chinese observations of what we're doing and um figuring out uh what what they can learn from that so i think that's a collateral effect um as as we expose what the joint force uh displays on on the battlefield um and uh uh uh i think we can talk uh in a little more detail as we move to the classified sessions some of the the things that we're collecting specifically about uh

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:33:19 – 2:33:20

what those effects are.

Sen. Reed (RI)2:33:20 – 2:33:22

Thank you very much, sir. Thank you, Mr.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:33:21 – 2:34:36

Senator Ossoff. Thank you, Mister Chairman, uh, thank you all for being here, but before I ask you a few questions, I wanna call everyone's attention again to this fundraising email signed by the President, that Senator Kelly mentioned earlier, in which the President of the United States invites his campaign donors to quote, claim your spot, claim your spot, join now, to receive private national security briefings to his political donors, featuring a photo of the president at a dignified transfer ceremony with a flag-draped coffin of an American service member killed in action returning to their family. And the American people need to know that the President of the United States is fundraising for his political campaign and his PAC using images of American service members killed in action, and it's a disgrace. Now, Director Gabbard, I'd like to reground this in your core responsibilities. Under the law, you are responsible for providing national intelligence to the president, correct?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:34:38 – 2:34:38

Yes.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:34:38 – 2:34:41

And to the heads of executive branch departments and agencies, yes?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:34:41 – 2:34:42

Yes.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:34:42 – 2:34:45

And to the chairman of the joint chiefs and senior military commanders?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:34:46 – 2:34:48

Across the IC, yes.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:34:48 – 2:34:51

And to the Senate and the House and relevant committees, correct?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:34:52 – 2:34:52

Yes.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:34:52 – 2:35:00

And the law states that the national intelligence you provide to Congress, quote, should be timely, objective and independent of political considerations, correct?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:35:00 – 2:35:01

Yes.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:35:01 – 2:35:10

And you noted in your opening statement you're here fulfilling a statutory responsibility and that your testimony, quote, represents the IC's assessment of threats,

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:35:10 – 2:35:10

That's right.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:35:10 – 2:35:24

correct? And that opening statement as submitted to the committee in advance of this hearing stated that as a result of last summer's airstrikes, quote, "Iran's nuclear enrichment program was obliterated", end quote. Correct?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:35:24 – 2:35:25

That's right.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:35:26 – 2:35:28

And is that in fact the assessment of the intelligence community?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:35:28 – 2:35:29

Yes.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:35:29 – 2:35:36

So the assessment of the intelligence community is that Iran's nuclear enrichment program was obliterated by last summer's airstrikes.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:35:36 – 2:35:36

Yes.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:35:37 – 2:35:46

And the opening statement you submitted to the committee last night also stated, quote, "There has been no effort since then to try to rebuild their enrichment capability, end quote. Correct?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:35:47 – 2:35:47

That's right.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:35:47 – 2:35:50

And that's the assessment of the intelligence community.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:35:48 – 2:35:50

Mm-hmm. Yes.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:35:51 – 2:36:12

The White House stated on March first of this year that this war was launched and was, quote, a military campaign to eliminate the imminent nuclear threat posed by the Iranian regime, end quote. That's a statement from the White House, quote, the imminent nuclear threat posed by the Iranian regime. Was it the assessment of the intelligence

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:36:18 – 2:36:26

The intelligence community assessed that Iran maintained the intention to rebuild and to continue to grow their nuclear enrichment capability.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:36:26 – 2:36:33

Was it the assessment of the intelligence community that there was a, quote, imminent nuclear threat posed by the Iranian regime, yes or no?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:36:33 – 2:36:38

Senator, the only person who can determine what is and is not an imminent threat is the President,

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:36:38 – 2:36:38

False.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:36:38 – 2:36:40

and he made that determination.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:36:38 – 2:37:11

This is the worldwide, this is the worldwide threat searing where you present to Congress national intelligence, timely, objective, and independent of political considerations. You've stated today that the intelligence community's assessment is that Iran's nuclear enrichment program was obliterated and that, quote, " there had been no efforts since then to try to rebuild their enrichment capability." Was it the intelligence community's assessment that nevertheless, despite this obliteration, there was a, quote, " imminent nuclear threat" posed by the Iranian regime? Yes or no?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:37:11 – 2:37:16

It is not the intelligence community's responsibility to determine what is and is not an imminent threat.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:37:16 – 2:37:16

OK.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:37:16 – 2:37:20

That is up to the president based on a volume of information and the comments

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:37:17 – 2:37:20

He here's here's the problem. No, it is, it is precisely,

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:37:20 – 2:37:21

that he receives.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:37:21 – 2:38:04

it is precisely your responsibility to determine what constitutes a threat to the United States this is the worldwide threats hearing where as you noted in your opening testimony, quote, you represent the IC's assessment of threats. You are here to represent the IC's assessment of threats. That's a quote from your own opening statement. And so my question is, as you're here to present the IC's assessment of threats, was it the assessment of the intelligence community that as the White House claimed on March first there was a quote imminent nuclear threat posed by the Iranian regime? Yes or no?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:38:04 – 2:38:12

Once again, Senator, the intelligence community has, uh, provided the inputs that make up this annual threat assessment.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:38:12 – 2:38:13

You won't answer the question.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:38:13 – 2:38:20

It is the nature of the imminent threat that the president has to make that determination, based on a collection and volume

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:38:20 – 2:38:22

You're here to be timely.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:38:20 – 2:38:23

of information and intelligence that he is provided with.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:38:22 – 2:38:28

You're here, you're here to be timely, objective, and independent of political considerations.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:38:28 – 2:38:29

Exactly what I'm doing.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:38:29 – 2:38:53

No, you're evading a question because to provide a candid response to the committee would contradict a statement from the White House. Let me ask you about your presence in Fulton County on January twenty eighth of this year. You were present at the FBI's raid on the Fulton County elections office on January twenty eighth, correct?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:38:53 – 2:38:59

I was present for part of the FBI exercising a warrant approved by a municipal judge

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:38:59 – 2:38:59

Yes,

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:38:59 – 2:39:00

to obtain my

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:38:59 – 2:39:01

and the FBI was there executing,

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:39:01 – 2:39:01

for an investigation.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:39:01 – 2:39:08

the FBI was there executing that warrant to seize ballots and materials associated with the twenty twenty election, correct?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:39:08 – 2:39:09

Yes.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:39:09 – 2:39:15

And are you aware that members of this committee have already opened inquiries into your election related activities?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:39:15 – 2:39:16

Yes.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:39:16 – 2:39:23

And are you aware that your general counsel and deputy general counsel have already provided testimony to this committee regarding those activities?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:39:23 – 2:39:23

Yes.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:39:24 – 2:39:29

On February second, you sent a letter to Senator Warner regarding your presence at the raid. Was that letter accurate?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:39:31 – 2:39:35

Uh, I don't recall the exact date, but if I sent a letter that had my signature, it was accurate.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:39:36 – 2:39:40

You stated in the letter that your presence at the raid was quote, requested by the president, correct?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:39:40 – 2:39:40

Yes.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:39:40 – 2:39:43

When did the president request your presence at the raid?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:39:43 – 2:39:48

Uh, the day of the raid, uh, the warrant execution commencing.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:39:49 – 2:39:50

The day of the raid.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:39:50 – 2:39:51

Yes.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:39:51 – 2:39:52

He called you on the phone?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:39:52 – 2:40:02

I'm not gonna disclose how the message was delivered, but it was a request from the president's administration to go and help oversee this warrant being executed along with the deputy director of the

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:40:03 – 2:40:04

Is it your role to oversee?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:40:03 – 2:40:06

and to thank the FBI agents who were conducting this work.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:40:06 – 2:40:09

Is it your role to oversee the execution of criminal warrants?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:40:09 – 2:40:18

It is my moral, uh, uh, based on statute that Congress has passed to have oversight over election security, to include counterintelligence,

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:40:18 – 2:40:20

But you said you you over you oversaw the raid, correct?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:40:18 – 2:40:19

to include

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:40:20 – 2:40:22

You just testified you oversaw the raid?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:40:23 – 2:40:24

Portions of it.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:40:24 – 2:40:27

OK. Did you handle any ballots or election related materials?

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:40:27 – 2:40:27

No.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:40:27 – 2:40:34

You were inside an FBI evidence truck, correct? You were photographed inside an FBI evidence truck.

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:40:33 – 2:40:35

It was an empty truck, yes.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:40:36 – 2:40:40

The president stated quote, you looked at votes that wanted to be checked out.

Sen. Cotton (AR)2:40:38 – 2:40:42

Senator's time is expired. The senator's time is expired.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:40:40 – 2:40:43

Is that accurate? Did you look at votes as the president stated?

Sen. Cotton (AR)2:40:43 – 2:40:45

Senator Ossoff, your time has expired.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:40:45 – 2:40:46

You respond for the record?

Sen. Cotton (AR)2:40:45 – 2:40:49

You can have her No, she cannot respond because

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:40:48 – 2:40:53

No, for the record, will will the will the director please respond for the record to that question, is my

Tulsi Gabbard (Witness)2:40:53 – 2:40:55

I'm happy to respond to questions for the record.

Sen. Ossoff (GA)2:40:53 – 2:40:56

my question. Thank you, Director Gabbard.

Sen. Cotton (AR)2:40:57 – 2:40:59

Thank you. Vice Chairman.

Sen. Warner (VA)2:41:00 – 2:41:40

i just wanna um not gonna go back to this issue i'm sure we'll address in the um eh in the close setting but i am very disappointed uh this is the only one time a year the public gets to hear from you guys in this kind of setting and the fact that we have repeated public reporting including a major story in the wall street journal today about china and russia assisting iran which seems obvious and evident. And none of you would confirm that publicly, I think, doesn't give the American people the full challenges of this war.

Sen. Cotton (AR)2:41:43 – 2:43:00

I would add what I said earlier, that the media is not a classification authority, but certainly sounds like something Russia and China would do, and they have done for decades in the past to Americans. Uh, to wrap up a little business here before we adjourn the open session, we will reconvene in thirty minutes in our usual location for the closed session, that's at twelve fifty-six promptly. Um, I do want to note, uh, for the record that Senator Young cannot join us. He is at Dover Air Force Base for the dignified transfer of remains for one of our fallen heroes a Hoosier um and I would invite everyone to join Senator Young, in praying for the family and friends uh of that soldier and all the soldiers who have given their life in the defense of our freedom and security. Uh, General Hartman, I wanna again acknowledge you, uh, given your impending retirement since this is your last appearance for the committee. I'm sure you hope, and I'm sure that the thing you'll miss most about your long career in uniform is testifying before Congress. Uh, I remind members that questions for the record will be due by the close of business on Friday, March twenty, and the audience will remain seated for a moment so that our witnesses and members may exit and proceed promptly to the closed session. This open session is adjourned.

Sen. Warner (VA)2:43:01 – 2:43:02

Thank you.

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