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Senate · Hearing transcript

Hearings to examine COVID-19 injections and attacks on scientific publications.

Wednesday, June 3, 2026

Summary

  • Ron Johnson convened hearing alleging COVID-19 mRNA injections may cause cancer through plausible mechanisms while suppressing dissenting research and injury reports.
  • Angus Dalgleish (Professor Emeritus of Oncology, City St. George's, University of London) reported relapses after boosters and urged banning mRNA vaccines.
  • Ron Johnson pressed Julie Gralow (Chief Medical Officer and Executive Vice President, American Society of Clinical Oncology) on mRNA persistence, biodistribution, and DNA contamination.
  • Richard Blumenthal cited National Cancer Institute finding no evidence vaccines cause cancer, while Ron Johnson highlighted VAERS deaths and FDA surveillance failures.
  • Wafik El-Deiry (Director, Legorreta Cancer Center, Brown University) urged investigation of spike protein links to cancer and protection for scientists from retaliation.

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Hearing Details

Witnesses

Members Who Spoke

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Transcript

Sen. Johnson (WI)21:00 – 28:56

Good afternoon. This hearing is called to order. Um, just brief explanation of uh how this hearing came about. I I met uh Doctor Sabine Hazen in October of two thousand twenty one, uh during the, really the the height of a covid. And uh re- really related to all the work I was doing in terms of early treatment and then Uh the the COVID injection injured, that type of thing and and I'm not quite sure how you got it on my radar screen, but uh we struck up a a good texting relation texting relationship. And uh Immediately I wa- I was Dr. Hayes made me aware of of how her research, which was conducted with, uh supported by, uh guided by, overseen by the FDA, was being sabotaged. And, with all the hearings and and uh, events I had done, I I was trying to figure out some way of how can we, how can we hold a hearing on this? Cuz this is, this is really bad for science, to to have research sabotaged. Um, end of last year, Doctor Hazen introduced me to Doctor El-Diri, who, probably a poster child, for being tormented by, I'll call them trolls, uh, i- into science. And so, we put together this hearing, um, it's kind of predicated on Doctor El-Diri's work, that I think prompted all the attacks. Um, that that's why that's why I'm holding this hearing. So, let me get into my opening statement. Uh, I wanna thank all the witnesses, I know this is a a real imposition, take a lot of time and effort and and uh, expense to get here. But today's hearing is titled, Plausible Mechanisms of COVID-19 Injections Causing Cancer. and attacks on scientific publications and research. Although it may seem these are two unrelated topics, discussing them together will help explain why such a large percentage of the public remains unaware of the serious adverse events caused by the COVID MRNA injections. In April, the subcommittee held a hearing and released a report exposing how how top FDA officials decided to use a safety surveillance algorithm that they knew would, and in fact did, hide safety signals on extremely serious adverse events, including sudden death. This was a bombshell revelation that unfortunately was dismissed by this subcommittee's ranking member and completely ignored by the legacy media. So it's nineteen ninety seven when the Clinton administration made America only the second nation on earth to allow mass media advertising on pharmaceutical products, Big Pharma has spent billions on TV ads to capture the media and as a result, the narrative. Prior to nineteen ninety seven, there was serious journalism covering suspected vaccine injuries. In nineteen ninety seven, Mike Wallace reported on CBS's sixty minutes about swine flu vaccine injuries. By the way, they pulled the swine flu vaccine after about twenty five to thirty deaths. And four to five hundred cases of Guillaume Barré disease. They pulled it. Twenty to thirty, twenty five to thirty deaths. We have over thirty nine thousand deaths right now associated with the COVID injection worldwide from the VAERS vaccine, but I'll move on. In nineteen eighty two, WRC TV's Leah Thompson reported on the findings of their more than year-long investigation into the safety and effectiveness of the pertussis component of the DPT vaccine. In nineteen eighty five, Phil Donahue discussed both the swine flu and DPT vaccines, and related injuries during his hour-long show. Since nineteen ninety seven, there have been a few reports on hepatitis B, MMR, HPV vaccine safety, but the quote safe and effective unquote mantra, combined with the narrative that adverse effects are quote rare and generally mild unquote has overwhelmed any coverage of the harms. Legacy Media is not the only American institution that has been captured and controlled. Big Pharma also hires and financially awards former federal health agency officials and spends lavishly on lobbying and political d- donations of to lawmakers of both parties. It generously funds other members of the COVID cartel, social media, medical associations like the American Medical Association, and the American Association of Pediatricians. international health organizations, medical colleges, and medical journals. The testimony of today's hearing raises the question of whether big pharma might also be funding individuals who troll scientific research that runs counter to its goals and narratives. It should come as no surprise, therefore, that during the pandemic, treatment alternatives using cheap and safe generic drugs were not only suppressed but acti actively sabotaged in favor of a liability-free, and highly profitable experimental gene therapy, and that's what it is. The fact that all the institutions that benefit from big pharmas largesse actively push the experimental gene therapy is also the reason they are now working so hard to suppress the reality of COVID MRNA injection injuries. Testimony given in April's hearing detailed the safety studies that were not done on the COVID injections prior to their emergency use authorization. and eventual full approval. This list of omitted studies should shock everyone. Again, these were just in testimony. Drug-drug interactions, cardiovascular toxicity, central nervous system toxicity, other organ toxicity, blood toxicity, gene toxicity, and carcinogenicity. Um Those studies weren't conducted. I'm not sure they've been conducted even today, because it's proved Now we just don't wanna know. Although leg legacy media, federal health officials and the medical establishment continue to ignore and hide the lies told and the harms done by governments in response to the coronavirus, alternate media has been spreading spreading the truth to a growing percentage of the global public. As a result, trust in these institutions is eroding. The only way, the only way to rebuild that lost trust is for the truth to be acknowledged in a process of public reckoning. The hearings I've been holding are intended to contribute to that reckoning. They will hear from highly credentialed and experienced doctors and medical researchers who will disc- discuss the plausible mechanisms of COVID MRNA injection harms. They will also describe the attacks they are experiencing on their research and reputations because they have the courage to expose the truth. I wanna sincerely thank the witnesses for their courage and the time and effort they put in their testimony and uh advocacy. Let let me just add on this note. In in a couple of my public hearings, I I conclude with the statement that that I am truly amazed at the knowledge that mankind has accumulated over the millennia. I mean, it is amazing what we know and how rapidly we're gaining that knowledge. But in spite of that, I would argue that what we don't know vastly, and I mean vastly exceeds what we do. And so in any kind of discussion like this, in any kind of scientific research, I think people involved need to approach these problems with that level of modity, modesty and that kind of humility. So if that, I'll turn it over to our ranking member, Blumenthal.

Sen. Blumenthal (CT)29:01 – 33:49

thank you chairman johnson like to begin my remarks by reminding everybody watching today that the national cancer institute has concluded quote there is no evidence that covid-nineteen vaccines cause cancer lead to recurrence or lead to disease progression. That is the National Cancer Institute. Quote, "there is no evidence that COVID-19 vaccines cause cancer, lead to recurrence, or lead to disease progression." End quote. I could conclude there. But I think that this hearing really merits a fuller explanation of what is at stake here. Because we need more research into finding cancer cures and more research into preventing cancer in the first place. Cancer causes fear for everyone, and almost everyone, I venture to say, in fact, everyone has been touched by cancer in some way, and so that fear is pervasive. We can't allow that fear to cause unfounded attacks on the covid vaccines or any other vaccine. These vaccines have saved millions of lives, and we should all be rooting for similar feats of science to help people who are stricken with cancer or help to prevent it. Cancer data is very closely tracked in the united states and the idea that a rollout of covid-nineteen vaccines has precipitated a surge in cancer is simply not supported nor do the vaccines make cancer grow faster according to the american cancer society most cancer doctors recommended vaccination against covid-nineteen for the cancer patients they are treating Unfortunately, messages about the safety and effectiveness of vaccination are increasingly deluged by myths and misinformation, immunization rates are declining across the country, diseases like measles are surging. And tragically also, vaccines have been proven to prevent certain types of cancer, those vaccines are facing groundless attacks from top public health officials, maybe not surprisingly because hhs secretary robert f. kennedy initially declined to surrender his financial stake in litigation against the maker of hp v vaccines and then only under pressure from congress turned his interest over to his son there is ample evidence in fact that hpv vaccines help prevent cervical cancer a disease that is projected to kill forty two hundred americans this year and i'm grateful that we have tamika felder a cervical cancer survivor here with us today i really thank her for being here you're doing us a great service it's stories like yours miss felder that remind us of the human impact of science's great successes. And I'm also grateful to have Doctor Julie Grelow, the Chief Medical Officer of the American Society of Clinical Oncology, who's here to remind us about the absence of credible scientific evidence linking COVID-19 vaccines to cancer and the safety of the vaccines for people undergoing cancer treatment. very important and thank you doctor graylow uh just one example of the overwhelming evidence of the safety of these vaccines i would like to submit for the record a study from the journal of the american medical association involving nearly thirty million people and finding that four years after vaccination people who received an mrna covid-nineteen vaccine were less likely to die from cancer than those who were not vaccinated i ask that it be under the record if there's no objection mr. chairman

Sen. Johnson (WI)33:49 – 33:54

uh no objection i mean that's as good as the commonwealth fund study entered in previous hearing but go no no objection

Sen. Blumenthal (CT)33:54 – 36:29

thank you it's unfortunate that we need doctor graylow to appear before a hearing like this one when there are much more pressing threats to cancer patients and cancer research coming from trump administration policies. And that's the big issue here. And the reason that I am expanding on what I said earlier, because the administration has put up needless roadblocks that have slowed the flow of grants to cancer researchers. Halts to funding imposed early last year caused the American Association of Cancer Institutes to warn that the Trump administration policies were, quote, "slowing progress against cancer and the trump administration's obvious animus toward mrna technology that was used for covid-nineteen vaccines threatens some of the most promising research for targeted cancer treatments the studies canceled the patients excluded from trials the treatments abandoned decisions made today about cancer research will impact us and our children for decades to come. Just days ago, scientists announced amazing results from the study of a new drug for prostate cancer, one of the hardest cancers to treat. These results were possible in part because of work done many years ago at the National Cancer Institute. One scientist who helped with that research said, quote, " "this kind of basic research is being greatly threatened by current government policies. Basic research is essential. It's not just COVID vaccines. It's not just cancer vaccines. It's all kinds of medical treatment that you will find in hospitals today, saving lives, beginning with basic research that is being throttled by this administration. And so, I hope we can all agree that advancing cures for cancer and stopping the forces that undermine them ought to be a top priority for all of us in Congress. It ought to be a bipartisan cause. I hope my colleagues will take up the mantle with me. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Sen. Johnson (WI)36:30 – 37:39

Thanks, Senator Blumenthal. Uh, it is the tradition of this, uh, subcommittee to swear in witnesses. So if you all rise and raise your right hand. Do you swear or affirm the testimony you will give before the subcommittee will be the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so help you God. You're seated. Our first witness is Doctor Angus Dalglish. Uh Doctor Dalglish is Professor Emeritus of Oncology at City St. George's University of London. where he has pioneered the immunotherapy of cancer. He is known for his work on HIV and cancer, and received the Joshua Liederberg Prize in two thousand eleven for his work developing cancer treatments. He's been the principal of the Institute of Cancer Vaccines and Immunotherapy since two thousand, and a consultant in general medicine, immunology, virology, and oncology since nineteen eighty six. And by the way, these are very abbreviated biologies, or biographies. I mean, each one of these individuals on both sides have much larger biographies that uh you should take a look at but uh i i i i forced them to abbreviate it uh doctor.

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)37:42 – 42:46

thank you very much for asking me to uh give evidence on this i just like to point out that i have done as you say i have been in cancer immunotherapy i have been in cancer immunotherapy for over three decades and uh i have made uh big advantage advances in the treatment of cancer with the immunotherapy So this sets the scene that I then I became aware in uh early twenty uh two of my patients who'd been uh uh stable for years uh do mainly melanoma patients. They'd had several different types of immunotherapy. And in six weeks I saw six patients relapse with melanoma. They had uh they'd been stable for three to eighteen years. They felt well apart from the relapse and being investigative, I asked, you know, what was the thing that was common. And the thing that was common is they'd all received a booster vaccine from their general practitioners. Now, I know that these cancers are c- totally controlled by the T cell response, so I immediately suspected the T cell response was being perturbated by the cancer. And initial, uh, investigations show that this was likely to be true. However, there was then a paper published by some uh doctors in Madrid, which, and I quote, their paper is called " The Evidence of Exhausted Lymphocytes After the Third Anti-Sars COVID-2 Vaccine, Dosing Cancer Patients". I mean, this was absolutely staggering, that they showed across hundreds of patients that you get this T cell suppression. Hard on the heels of this, were then a numerous reports that the uh following the booster vaccine, we were getting IgG immunoglobulin switching, so you converted the immune system from being aggressive fighting invaders to one of tolerization. So therefore, the immune system was tolerating the cancer and this was the reason that we were starting to see it. However, it is important at this stage to say that we were getting reports after I first of other cancers. And my initial observation that this was all due to T cell suppression started to, um, fade in into the, uh, perspective that other a- actors were at work with the vaccine, as it were. Colorectal cancer was being reported by my patients, by my, uh, fellow surgeons as reporting, uh, as, uh, presenting late stage four, not stage one or two, and early in in patients in their twenties and thirties and forties in a way that we have not seen before. And then in my own practice, as I was looking for patients, uh, who had um who'd had other cancers, I noticed that they too had had booster vaccines and I list them in my report. They go from everything from the common cancers, from breast, prostate, et cetera, and all the way through to some really unexpected ones, including glioma, and more recently hematological malignancies. Now, looking at the uh literature as to why this uh could be, and I'm involved in uh two big publications, one's been accepted prior to uh um uh prior to um changes. And this shows that there are remarkable, at least a dozen mechanisms where messenger RNA can insert into the DNA and activate oncogenes and And more importantly, and especially the long term, they can suppress uh the suppressor networks, which means if cancer is starting to evolve, it would normally be maintained, uh controlled, and this mechanism is being prevented. And the number of people who've shown this is quite enormous. So as an oncologist, who I starting to see that it's not only my patients now, it's people I know really well. who are going down with cancer and they're going down more aggressively and the treatment is not working nearly as well. And I'm used to people saying, oh, there's no evidence of the cancer's increasing and that there's anything to do with the vaccine. But I can assure you from the patients that I have seen, that many have seen, uh, a dozen doctors before. Not one of them has ever asked the vaccine history. So of course they see no evidence. And my full detailed research into the messenger RNA vaccines and I was on the scientific board of a company claimed to be the messenger RNA vaccine, uh, company for five years and left eight years ago. So I know a lot more than the average clinician and make myself and others feel that there is no way you can control this technology and its use for future vaccines should be banned and the COVID one stopped now.

Sen. Johnson (WI)42:47 – 43:16

Thank you, Dr. Dalish. Dalish, you need to stay right on time. Appreciate that. Uh, next witness is Dr. Wafeek El-Diri. Uh, Dr. El-Diri is a practicing physician scientist, American Cancer Society professor, founding director of the Cancer Center at Brown University, and chair of the worldwide innovative network consortium in precision oncology. He discovered a tumor suppressant gene he named WAF WAF-one and a first of its kind drug approved by FDA last year for the treatment of an aggressive brain cancer. Dr. El-Diri.

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)43:18 – 50:35

Um, thank you, Senator Johnson and Senator Blumenthal and distinguished committee members for the. You're so sure. Um. Thank you, Senator Johnson, Senator Blumenthal and distinguished committee members for the opportunity to speak at this important hearing. Um. I am a physician scientist and cancer researcher with more than thirty years of experience studying um how our body normally fights cancer through a major tumor suppressor called p fifty three uh and finding new ways of treating it i have also advocated on capitol hill since two thousand five for support of research funding which is really vital uh my work has has focused on how cancers develop within when these uh normal tumor suppressor mechanisms fail uh including discoveries and involving uh how tumor suppressors uh work and this has become foundational in cancer biology and oncology research i've also studied how viruses and other biological processes can disrupt our defenses against cancer so when the covid pandemic uh began i wanted to help by applying our expertise in cancer biology, immunology and approved treatments to better understand and treat covid. uh it's been long understood that certain viruses contribute to cancer development by disrupting tumor suppressor pathways, including p fifty-three, one of the body's most important cancer protective mechanisms. Early in the pandemic, i became concerned that the covid virus might similarly interfere with these defense mechanisms, making this an important area for scientific investigation. Early in the pandemic, I also expressed uncertainty on social media about the natural origin of the COVID virus and this is when I first started to experience repercussions of speaking out against the mainstream narrative. What I didn't expect were the attacks on science itself. By July, twenty twenty, my laboratory published findings showing that class of cancer drugs known as mech inhibitors suppressed ace to the cell surface receptor the covet virus uses to infect human cells. By April of twenty four, we reported findings suggesting that the spiked protein associated with uh covet infection or covet vaccination could reduce the ability of p fifty-three to activate genes involved in suppressing cancer. Based on these findings, we emphasize that effective vaccines against viruses such as covid should strengthen immunity against infection without interfering with the body's natural defenses against cancer these concerns were raised through normal scientific channels yet the response was not open scientific engagement but escalating attacks instead of contributing to scientific dialogue, the findings triggered attacks on both the research and the researchers involved. Much of this occurred through an on-line platform known as Papir, originally created about a decade ago to identify fraud and scientific misconduct. Unfortunately, the platform increasingly became weaponized against researchers whose findings challenged prevailing narratives. The platform permits anonymous accusations without meaningful accountability. There's no disclosure of conflicts of interest, no statute of limitations, or citizenship requirements. These attacks are public, amplified through social media, and can continue indefinitely regardless of whether wrongdoing is ever established. This is precisely what happened to us. Although we corrected minor errors where appropriate and continued to do so, none altered the underlying results or conclusions of our work. Nevertheless, uh, our publications became subject of sustained public attacks that damaged reputation and undermined scientific uh uh credibility. Um, despite these ongoing attacks, last summer I agreed to serve on an HHS committee, uh, on immunization practices, working group on COVID immunizations, and as an expert, uh, uh, uh, uh, I, I therefore, uh looked into uh everything we know about cancer and covid infection and covid vaccination and by the fall found uh nearly seventy papers describing more than three hundred reported cancer cases from twenty seven countries following one or more covid m r n a vaccine injections um the reported in uh uh cancers occurred near injection sites like sarcomas or lymphomas right at the injection site, uh within the head and neck region, within and elsewhere, including as Doctor Deglich mentioned, uh brain tumors and and other tumors. Um in some reported cases, spike protein was identified within tumor tissue. Our findings were published in January of this year, and shortly afterwards I was contacted directly by former Japanese Minister, Kazuhiro Haraguchi, who reported developing a diffuse large B cell lymphoma, that later metastasized to a tonsil, and biopsy, then they found spike protein, there should be no spike in tumors. Uh, these observations warrant serious scientific investigation, um, and as such, a number of unexpected uh, observations has been have been made with the COVID-MRNA vaccines that uh suggest potentially plausible mechanisms and connections to cancer. The attacks on my publications intensified and continue to the present day, despite no findings of fraud, misconduct or wrongdoing after years of investigation. I am for vaccines that are safe and effective. Both our paper and the journal itself became targets of attacks through pub peer and related on-line campaigns. I remain in effect guilty until proven innocent. Patients deserve informed consent. Scientists deserve the freedom to investigate legitimate scientific concerns. There are many open questions, including who is at greatest risk from these vaccines? And there shouldn't be fear of reputational destruction, institutional retaliation, or professional ruin. Papier needs to be held accountable for making false accusations against positions and scientists that destroy reputations and careers. Thank you.

Sen. Johnson (WI)50:35 – 51:06

Thank you, Doctor El-Diri, our next uh witness is Doctor Saskia Mostert. Uh, Doctor Mostert studied medicine at VU Amsterdam in the Netherlands, and conducted a PHD program in compliance in childhood leukemia treatment in Indonesia. She then worked as a research coordinator of global health and pediatric oncology research programs at Amsterdam University Medical Center, and Princess Maxima Center. Her fields of expertise include treatment compliance, the problem of corruption in medicine, and hospital detention practices. Doctor Mostert.

Saskia Mostert (Witness)51:13 – 58:46

Dear members of the um American Senate, in two thousand twenty four our team published a study in BMJ Public Health examining all cause mortality data across Western countries, between two thousand twenty and twenty-two. These were government reported mortality records routinely used throughout mainstream public health. The peer review process had taken more than nine months. Our study showed that excess mortality remained elevated across forty-seven Western countries, totaling more than three million excess deaths. Excess mortality persisted across the overwhelming majority of countries studied after the acute phase of the pandemic. We did not claim certainty regarding the causes of excess mortality. Rather, we asked attention for three major events that were non-existent before the pandemic, the COVID infection, the containment measures and the COVID vaccines. In addition, we acknowledged other overlooked factors. We urged governments and public health leaders to investigate the underlying causes and evaluate their policies. During the pandemic, extraordinary measures were justified in the name of protecting human life. Public officials and media emphasized that every COVID death mattered and every life deserved protection. I believe the discovery of more than three million excess deaths would prompt the same urgency in investigating their causes. Instead, what followed often resembled what I could only describe as blind fury. What could explain this massive outrage? During the pandemic, health policies were combined with psychological tactics to influence public behaviour governments and media implemented psychological manipulation and fear propaganda without our awareness or consent, that increases conformity and reduces tolerance for reason and dissenting voices, such as tunnel vision, emotional messaging, polarization, and important, the distinguish the distinction between worthy versus unworthy victims, so distinguishing between important victims who deserve extensive attention or support and other victims who can be ignored. Censorship and suppression tactics have been used against doctors and scientists questioning the official COVID narrative. I will mention a few. The devaluation tactics, discrediting critics and criticism using labelling such as misinformation. Cover-up tactics, hiding censorship using proxies, fact-checkers, shadow-banning and de-platforming. Re-interpretation tactics, favourably framing censorship as protection of the public or follow the science. Official channel tactics, which gives the censorship the appearance of legitimacy of justice and hides political or economic conflicts of interest. And last but not least, the intimidation tactics, using fear, threats coercion to silence critics and others. Encountered blind in irrational fury after our publication can thus be explained by tunnel vision disruption. Not only the worthy victims, the COVID patients, but also the unworthy victims, the lockdown victims and the vaccine injured were described. Polarization in society between those who followed the official COVID narrative and those who questioned it became visible. Despite a supportive statement from Reuters, media outlets used their devaluation tactics and labelled the publication as anti-facts, conspiracy theory and misinformation. One affiliated hospital publicly distanced itself from the study and announced a scientific integrity investigation. Institutional responses are increasingly used as official channel tactics, to discredit, intimidate, isolate and silence those raising unwelcome scientific questions. I resigned. Scientific integrity investigations can be evaluated according to confidentiality transparency presumption of innocence and fairness principles. To my opinion, all these principles have been trampled on the institutional confidential report about my co-authors was leaked to a national newspaper, and resulted in a hit piece. This example speaks volumes. Be clear, I lost my position after publishing official government mortality data, and calling for further scientific investigation into persistent excess deaths. Science cannot function when legitimate questions become professionally dangerous to ask. When scientists fear professional destruction, the public loses access to honest scientific inquiry. The institute concluded that scientific integrity was not violated in our study. No plagiarism, fabrication or falsification took place. Nevertheless, the institute persists on retraction of the paper for containing misinformation about possible causes of excess mortality. Ironically, the text on containment measures and vaccines was much shorter in the original version of the paper. The reviewers selected by the journal had asked us to either delete the text or provide more evidence. As there is evidence available, we included it. All added references concern peer reviewed publications from well-known institutes, indexed on PubMed. My proposed post-publication revision that included a section on vaccine effectiveness in reducing mortality was ignored by the journal. Right from the start, it was an unequal battle. Our call for investigation of underlying causes had to be censored and erased, one way or another. The tunnel vision leaves no room for unworthy victims. Yet, the persistent excess mortality remains unexplained. Our case is not isolated. Books have documented the suppression of more than eighty Dutch doctors and scientists, as well as the removal of sixty professors across Germany, Austria and Switzerland. In recent years, the number of removals for ideological insubordination has increased significantly. Similar patterns emerge across institutions. After a media scandal, the university distances itself and starts disciplinary proceedings. The reason given for dismissal is scientific integrity violation, whereas the real reason appears to be dissent. Recently, we established a task force on academic freedom in the Netherlands to investigate censorship suppression and sup- systematic attacks on doctors and scientists questioning aspects of the official COVID narrative. Censorship undermines academic freedom by discouraging legitimate scientific inquiry. It narrows the range of perspectives permitted within public debate, and stimulates self-censorship among academics. Subsequent false scientific consensus can lead to dysfunctional policies. If we want to restore public trust, we must once again protect academic freedom and the right of scientists and doctors to question prevailing assumptions without fear of professional destruction. It is time to return to Voltaire's enlightenment commitment to academic freedom. I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to death your right to say it. Thank you.

Sen. Johnson (WI)58:46 – 59:14

Thank you, Doctor Molster. Uh, next we'll go to Doctor Sabine Hazen. Uh, Doctor Hazen received her MD in Canada and completed residency at the University of Miami. She's the first woman gastroenterology fellow at the University of Florida, and became an expert in the microbiome. She is currently the CEO of a private gastroenterology clinic and a clinical trial drug development company, as well as Progenibium LLC, a genetic research lab that studies the clinical implications of the microbiome. Doctor Hazen.

Saskia Mostert (Witness)59:27 – 59:27

OK.

Sabine Hazan (Witness)59:28 – 1:08:07

Alright, I'm Doctor Sabine Hazen, a Research Gastroenterologist. For more than three decades, I have done hundreds of clinical trials for leading pharmaceutical companies. My work has contributed to bringing biologics, antibiotics, and vaccines to market. While these advances have helped patients, they have also revealed critical gaps in our understanding of human health, particularly the gut microbiome. The microbiome, your bacteria in your gut, is your immunity. In twenty nineteen I founded Progenobiome, which is a research laboratory. And I say research because the microbiome research is at its infancy, and it's not gonna be of my lifetime. My goal was simple, to rigorously study the microbiome in real-world clinical settings. My team and la- and I launched sixty-one clinical trials to actively understand the gut connection in various diseases, Alzheimer's, autism, Parkinson's, cancer. This is precision medicine taking care to each patient's unique microbiome signature because yes in the microbiome space we're all different and if we're all different there is no normal in the microbiome space. So in twenty twenty I found myself in a very interesting position. I was taking care of high profile individuals in Malibu, I had a portal with the FDA that could write protocols and submit protocols to the FDA. And I had a research lab that could look at the microbiome. So this unique position, I felt like was the best person to be looking at the microbiome and looking at COVID. Uh, while exchanging information with scientists at NIST, the National Institute of Standards, who were looking at COVID in septic tanks. And by the way, for those of you who don't know National Institute of Standards, they overlook FDA, CDC. So, with discussions, Progenobiome became the first lab worldwide to document whole genome sequencing of COVID virus in clinical patient feces. Our paper was published in Gut Pathogens in twenty twenty one, after a six month peer review, only to be retracted in May twenty twenty five without any valid scientific justification. or even notifying the peer reviewers that approved the paper to begin with. I have to point out again that this was a landmark paper that showed COVID in the stools of clinical patients, not septic tanks, but clinical patients. While we were looking at stools, we discovered that hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin reduced the viral presence of COVID. In other words, COVID disappeared on these. However, those drugs also killed the microbiome. And that was the important finding during the pandemic that everybody's different and everybody needs a different treatment. Um, it is also important to note that during the pandemic I treated under FDA oversight. I actually wrote three protocols on hydroxychloroquine versus placebo, and ivermectin doxycycline versus placebo. And During my whole time that the FDA was watching, we lost no one. No one died on my shift. And by the way, I've treated thousands of patients. Doesn't the public wanna know how did I treat? What criteria did I use to s- to divide the treatment in patients? Um, we conducted a review of these patients treated and noticed actually that ivermectin-based multi-drug therapy helped severely hypoxic patients. This data was published in twenty twenty two after eight months of peer review scrutiny and then we tracked it in March twenty twenty five. We also published cardiac safety data from our phase two trial, using hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin. You will remember during the pandemic that there was a concern about cardiac problem from hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin. My team risked their lives putting Holter monitors on people's hearts, to monitor and capture the QT prolongation, and there were no QT prolongation. We published this data in December twenty twenty four. The paper was retracted in twenty twenty five, February. These these retractions consistently challenged the feasibility of early treatment. Remember, if there was a treatment, vaccines would not have passed. Our most significant discovery however, however, was on bifidobacteria. What is bifidobacteria, you ask? a bacteria that's in your probiotics, when you turn your bottle of probiotics, that's the bacteria, it's bifidobacteria. Bifidobacteria is an important microbe that helps you break down your food so that the sugar comes out and goes into the cell, into your mitochondria. Without bifidobacteria, the sugar is not going into your cell. Ask yourself, how is, how are you gonna metabolize, how are you gonna have immunity if you don't have your cells working? So, bifidobacteria was an extremely important finding because we discovered that severe COVID patients lacked bifidobacteria, while the patients that were high risk exposed had a lot of bifidobacteria. We also discovered that people with autism, Alzheimer's, Crohn's disease, Lyme disease, irritable bowel syndrome, mental health, invasive cancer, lacked bifidobacteria. Bifidobacteria appears in the young at a high level and disappears as we get older. We found that vitamin C, bovine immunoglobulin, and ivermectin, a fermented product of a bacteria called streptomyces, could help increase bifidobacteria and restore. Is that why we were seeing possibly hypoxic patients improving? I wrote a hypothesis. Perhaps ivermectin was improving the bifidobacteria. That pa- that hypothesis published and retracted in twenty twenty three. When a hypothesis is retracted, we've lost science and medicine. We then presented data on the vaccines, and we discovered that the vaccines killed the microbiome, specifically the Bifidobacteria. That abstract won the best research award at the American College of Gastro, and reached eighteen thousand GI doctors, yet was never published. If you follow the disappearance of Bifidobacteria in the gut, start to understand disease. You start to see why the newborns, one in twelve kids in Califor- twelve boys in California has autism. If you look at the data that just came out that showed newborns, t- only twenty-five percent of newborns are born with adequate levels of bifidobacteria. So if you restore the bifidobacteria like we did in our lab, in kids with autism, you will actually resume speech, which is what we showed in two twins where we restored the Bifida bacteria. That abstract won a research award at the American College of Gastro. In fact, ProgeniBiome has earned four consecutive awards at the American Col- College of Gastro, affirming peer recognition of our work, yet promising observations face problems and persistent barriers when attempting to publish papers pass rigorous review are retracted over minor, easily correctable issue. The main non-medical scientist that criticized my papers has patent on the microbiome. Can you say conflict of interest? So I ask Congress today, should non-physician without relevant clinical expertise review and override medical data from practicing physicians? True expertise must be challenged by qualified peers not outsiders. Members of Congress, imagine the possibilities if scientists could publish without fear of politically motivated retractions. If we could focus on advancing knowledge instead of defending it. The American people deserve transparent, rigorous science. Protecting scientific integrity is not just about my work, but it is about securing the future of medicine for all. Because ultimately, we're all gonna be patients. Thank you.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:08:07 – 1:08:11

Yeah. Thank you, Dr. Hazen. Uh, I was hoping we'd get through all the opening statements before we had to go vote,

Sabine Hazan (Witness)1:08:10 – 1:08:11

I know.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:08:11 – 1:23:15

but I've got a quick vote for so we'll put the hearing into recess and as soon as we get back we'll open it back up. So I No further disruptions. Our our next witness is Doctor Haseen Malhotra. Doctor Malhotra is a multi-award winning internationally renowned British cardiologist. He served an advisory role for health policy across governments, including as an ambassador to the Academy of Medical Royal Colleges and trustee of the King's Fund, a health policy think tank. He was ranked the number one doctor in the world influencing obesity thinking, and is named one of the UK's most influential scientists. Doctor.

Aseem Malhotra (Witness)1:23:17 – 1:28:05

Thank you, Senator Johnson. In January twenty twenty one, indoctrinated with the unlikelihood of any major harm, I took two doses. of Pfizer's mRNA vaccine, unaware at the time that it was in fact a prophylactic gene therapy product, and unlike any traditional vaccine. Although I was at very low risk of serious illness from COVID-19 due to my age and perfect metabolic health, I was inoculated to protect my patients. As one of the UK's most trusted doctors, I was requested to appear on Good Morning Britain to help tackle vaccine hesitancy amongst high-risk ethnic minority groups. Five months later, a personal tragedy triggered a complete U-turn in my perception of the vaccine. We were dealing with a medical product that was actually unsafe and defective. My fit and healthy seventy-three year old father, honorary Vice President of the British Medical Association, who also happened to be my best friend and last surviving member of my immediate family, died after suffering an unexpected cardiac arrest. Post-mortem findings revealed severe coronary artery disease, and subsequent published mechanistic evidence suggested that two doses of the mRNA COVID vaccine likely caused a massive acceleration in atherosclerosis leading to his sudden death. In twenty twenty two, I published a two-part peer-reviewed paper in the Journal of Insulin Resistance, calling for a moratorium on these unsafe and defective products. The most damning evidence was a re-analysis of Pfizer and Moderna's original trials. It determined a frequency of serious harm from the product that was two to four times more likely than being hospitalized with severe COVID. In my view, if the system had been more transparent, this prophylactic gene therapy would likely not have been injected into a single human being in the first place. Although there is now a multitude of high quality research supporting those analyses there's been predictable little to any mainstream media coverage, a symptom of the downstream effects of how big corporations exert their power by controlling the dominant narrative. I have personal experience with these downstream effects. Towards the end of last year, at the Reform Party political conference, I quoted Britain's most eminent oncologist, Professor Angus Dalgleish. He believes that the COVID-19 mRNA vaccine likely played a significant role in cancers of members of the royal family. Predictably, I was smeared and misrepresented in the media. Even the British Prime Minister, Sir Keir Starmer, misled Parliament. suggesting that I'd claimed that all vaccines cause cancer. In quotes, " these dangerous conspiracies cost lives", he said. I also experienced public smears and attacks from influential sections of the medical profession. I'm a grieving vaccine injured doctor. I've been diagnosed with a persistent autoimmune condition related to loss of bifida bacteria in my gut. An advanced blood test suggested I'm at slightly increased risk of cancer in the short term. Looking at the totality of up-to-date evidence, and what you've heard from eminent witnesses today, in my view, millions of Americans and millions more across the world may be in clear and present danger of suffering premature cardiovascular disease and cancer. Without allowing all scientists to debate this openly, without fear of censure, we will not be able to identify who is most at risk and how these risks can be mitigated. When it comes to making money, multinational corporations have been diagnosed by preeminent forensic psychologist, Doctor Robert Hare and Law Professor Joel Buchan as legal entities that fulfill the criteria for psychopathy. Characteristics include callous unconcern for the safety of others, incapacity to experience guilt, repeated lying, and conning others for profit. The evidence presented here today exposes the corporate tyranny underlying public health practice. This profitability over people rooted in the neoliberal economic model has led to trust being an all-time low in the medical profession. A full public apology from government bodies and medical leadership to the vaccine injured and bereaved, is an essential first step to in restoring that trust. Tyranny emerges when people are afraid to say what they think. When you have something to say, silence is a lie. When everyone lies all the time. the tyranny is complete. To save the health of the American people and to save democracy, it is our responsibility to expose, resist, and dismantle the era of corporate tyranny we currently find ourselves in. Thank you.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:28:06 – 1:28:19

Thank you, Doctor. Our next uh witness is Doctor Julie Gralo. Doctor Gralo is Executive Vice President and Chief Medical Officer for the American Society of Clinical Oncology. She is Professor Emeritus of Medical Oncology and Global Health at the University.

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:28:31 – 1:33:30

Thank you, Chairman Johnson. Ranking member Blumenthal and members of the subcommittee. Thank you for the opportunity to share my clinical perspective on this important topic. As you've heard, I'm the Chief Medical Officer and Executive Vice President for the Association for Clinical Oncology, or ASCO. a five O one C six organization established by the American Society of Clinical Oncology in twenty nineteen that represents more than fifty thousand oncology professionals who care for people living with cancer. ASCO works to ensure that all individuals with cancer have access to high quality care and we're committed to the principle that knowledge conquers cancer through research and education ASCO works to conquer cancer, and create a world where cancer is prevented or cured and every survivor is healthy. We appreciate the opportunities to discuss the critical role of MRNA technology in cancer care and the unwavering commitment to patient safety that guides its development. For nearly three decades prior to the COVID-19 pandemic, the primary driving force behind MRNA research was cancer immunotherapy. When exploring emerging therapies like MRNA vaccines, Oncology professionals rely on well-designed clinical trials to establish clinical efficacy evaluate unintended consequences and ensure the benefits outweigh the potential risks. Currently, there is no clinical evidence proving that MRNA COVID-19 vaccines cause cancer, or accelerate cancer growth. Cancer is caused by a series of G mutations and does not develop suddenly. Rather, tumor evolution is a multi-step process that generally takes years or even decades to manifest clinically. The appearance of late stage aggressive tumors within weeks or months of an injection is biologically incompatible with what we've learned from decades of research on the causes of cancer. In fact, RNA breaks down quickly in the body and doesn't enter a person's DNA. In other words, mRNA vaccines do not cause gene mutations. The benefits of COVID vaccination in patients with cancer are supported by a large and growing body of evidence. MRNA COVID-19 vaccines protect patients with cancer, who often have compromised immune systems, increasing their risk of negative outcomes if they contract COVID-19. Before vaccines were available, researchers at the University of Wisconsin-Madison found that COVID-19 patients with the current cancer diagnosis were twenty-four percent more likely to require intensive care and fifty-eight percent more likely to die in the hospital compared to after the vaccines became available. In contrast, a twenty twenty-five study led by investigators at Vanderbilt University found that cancer patients who received COVID-19 vaccinations had a fifty percent reduction in their risk of hospitalization. These data are reinforced by an ASCO study demonstrating a clinically significant relationship, between vaccination and survival in cancer patients diagnosed with COVID-nineteen. MRNA technology also represents a really exciting and significant clinical advancement for therapeutic cancer vaccines aimed at treating existing tumors unlike traditional treatments such as chemotherapy, which broadly destroys both cancerous and healthy dividing cells, MRNA technology is designed to teach an individual's body to recognize tumor markers that are unique to that patient's cancer, encouraging the patient's immune system to destroy just cancer cells, not healthy ones. While the FDA has not yet granted approval for MRNA cancer vaccine therapies, clinical trials are actively testing MRNA cancer vaccines and have reported good tolerability and promising clinical activity. For example, just this past week at our annual meeting, researchers shared the results of a trial that shows melanoma patients who receive a cancer-fighting MRNA vaccine, in addition to immunotherapy, had better cancer outcomes than patients who received the immunotherapy alone. Additional research led by investigators at MD Anderson found that patients who received the COVID vaccine along with immunotherapy to treat nonsmall cell lung cancer had better cancer outcomes than those who were not vaccinated. Existing research provides strong indications that MRNA vaccines will likely join approved immunotherapies as new options for patients with cancer facing difficult diagnoses. Thank you for the opportunity to testify on these important issues. ASCO remains deeply committed to advancing safe, evidence-based care for all patients, and I welcome your questions.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:33:31 – 1:33:46

Thank you, Dr. Gralo. Our f- last witness is Miss Tameka. felder miss felder is a cancer survivor award-winning women's health advocate, author, filmmaker and the founder of chief visionary officer at serva serva serva survivor

Tamika Felder (Witness)1:33:46 – 1:33:46

survivor

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:33:47 – 1:33:48

survivever

Tamika Felder (Witness)1:33:48 – 1:33:48

survivor

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:33:48 – 1:33:51

so just survivor you spell it different

Tamika Felder (Witness)1:33:51 – 1:33:52

mmm

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:33:52 – 1:34:09

i get it though uh survivor inc a nonprofit that specializes in cervical cancer and advocacy and support she currently survive certainly currently serves as a co-chair on the national h p v vaccination round table And is appointed by President Biden to be a member of the National Cancer Advisory Board. Miss Felder.

Tamika Felder (Witness)1:34:09 – 1:39:14

Thank you so much, um, to you, the chair, the ranking member, and to all of you here, um, for having me and especially for including the patient voice. My name is Tameka Felder, a twenty-five year cervical cancer survivor. Today I speak to the safety and importance of vaccines for all people, and to advocate for the open and accurate sharing of scientific information so that families and communities can protect themselves and future generations. I was diagnosed in two thousand and one at the age of twenty five, while working here in Washington DC as a broadcast journalist. The disease forced me to confront the fragility of health, and I endured a hysterectomy, chemotherapy, and radiation, which ultimately led to the loss of my fertility. Today as a survivor and patient advocate, I have dedicated my work to education, empowerment, and ensuring that every person has accurate, access to health health, medical information, trusted health care, and lifesaving prevention tools. I also firmly believe that the HPV vaccine, which would have offered protection against the HPV types most commonly associated with cervical cancer, could have changed the trajectory of my life. The human cost of cervical cancer remains a preventable disease for most people when prevention and screening are accessible and effectually utilized. Tuning lives are cut short by this disease. June is National Cancer Survivorship Month, and I am one of the eighteen point six million cancer survivors in the US. But I also want to recognize, honor, and mourn the individuals whose lives were also lost to cervical cancer, including Tialita Rickenbacker of Georgia, Jennifer Myers of Pennsylvania, Erica Fraser Stumm of Indiana, and Becky Wallace of California. These are just a few in the United States, an estimated Over six hundred thousand people who projected to die from cancer. This translates to about seventeen hundred deaths per day, making cancer the second leading cause of death in this country. Each of these women were more than a diagnosis. They were mothers, sisters, friends, and contributors to their communities. Their stories remind us why prevention, vaccination where appropriate, and continued research are essential to save others from needless suffering and loss. While other countries are nearing cervical cancer elimination, the United States despite having the tools needed for elimination. Vaccines approved for the use in the United States undergo rigorous multi-phase testing for safety and efficacy before they are licensed. The overwhelming majority of vaccines have favorable safety profiles and the benefits, reducing the reduction of infectious disease, prevention of severe illness and death, and protect protection of vulnerable populations, greatly outweigh the risk of rare adverse events. Vaccines are not just about one disease. They are about a standard approach to preventing contagious and deadly illnesses. The safety frameworks applied to vaccines across the board, routine immunizations for children, adults, and special populations. Cancer prevention vaccines like the HPV vaccines, influenza vaccines, and vaccines for other preventable diseases. Sup- science provides the best available evidence. and the safety and effectiveness of vaccines. We rely on rigorous research, transparent reporting, and peer peer-reviewed findings is essential to protect public health. In an era of rapid information exchange, we must commit to sharing factual science-based information. Misinformation and fear-mongering about vaccines undermine trust, delay or prevent vaccination, and leave people vulnerable to preventable diseases. Public health communication should be clear, compassionate, and inclusive. It should acknowledge concerns, provide transparent explanations of benefits and risks, and connect people with trusted health care providers who can answer questions and offer guidance. Survivors and patients must be at the center of conversations about vaccines and cancer prevention. We bring lived experiences with disease treatment and survivorship, perspective that matters when designing education, outreach, and clinical guidance. As a cervical cancer survivor and advocate, I see both the devastating toll of cancer and the profound promise of prevention. Vaccines, including the HP vaccine, are powerful tools when used alongside screening and treatment. We can reduce the burden. I want to thank you all for the opportunity to testify. I am grateful for your consideration of policies that protect communities today and for generations to come. And as Lindsay Gillette Lee reminded me yesterday, She's a three year cervical cancer survivor from North Carolina. May our stories pave the way so others don't have the same stories. As much as our stories matter, so do the science. Respectfully, Tameka Felder, founder of Survivor and twenty five year cervical cancer survivor.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:39:14 – 1:40:37

Thank you, Miss Felder. Um, I think it's probably f- safe to say people on on the panel, probably most people in this room, including myself, I mean, we we don't dispute the fact that the vaccines can be helpful and save lives. Uh, I think you can dispute some of the claims. Uh, but again, I don't I don't I've never been an anti-vaxxer. Um, I think our concern here, and one of the reasons I hold this hearing is there's just a denial of the vaccine and the injection injuries. Um, I'll I'll just again, you you had cervical cancer, uh, we had it at our voice the vaccine injured, um, a mother, Emily Tarso, whose daughter A twenty year old daughter died eighteen days after she received her third shot of Gardasil, the HPV vaccine. After eight years of litigation, this is how difficult it is to actually claim compensation through the government fund. Quote, HHS conceded by preponderance of the evidence, including challenge re-challenge that her daughter died from a HPV vaccination. They had no alternative explanation for her death. So again, I'm not a a vaccine denier. I'm we're we're battling vaccine injury deniers. That's part of our problem. But uh, you know, Doctor Grillo, uh, you mentioned that uh, MRNA uh degrades very rapidly in the body. Is is it your understanding belief that the MRNA in the COVID injections is that type of MRNA?

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:40:39 – 1:40:41

That is my understanding.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:40:42 – 1:41:28

Have you so you don't realize that that's not true MRNA, it's modified. It's modified is S S Sudoridine, is that the uh so it doesn't degrade. Uh, you're you're obviously then unaware of some of the studies that show that the, uh, spike is, is, uh, and the mRNA is, is circulating in the body up to two years. We haven't studied it longer than that, but it's, it's stayed in this body that, that long. Attaching to the cells. But, as long as I'm on this track, was it your belief that the, uh, the injection would stay in the, the arm? We, we were told that. It was gonna inject in the arm, stay there, uh, create antibodies, the mRNA was going to degrade very quickly, and That's why it was so safe. Is is it was that your understanding that the, and your belief that the injection stays in the arm?

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:41:29 – 1:41:36

Think the effects of the injection are total body. So the immune response, the the reaction.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:41:36 – 1:41:43

No, but I mean the the actual So so you're aware the the modified MRNA was encapsulated in the lipid nanopart, correct?

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:41:44 – 1:41:44

Right.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:41:44 – 1:41:48

So do you believe that package stayed in the arm as we were told it was going to do?

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:41:51 – 1:41:55

i i can't reliably comment on on

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:41:55 – 1:41:55

so so

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:41:55 – 1:41:56

that

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:41:56 – 1:42:00

so again you're you're saying how safe and effective this is but you don't know how it works

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:42:01 – 1:42:07

i do know how it works it incites um an immune reaction as vaccines do

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:42:07 – 1:42:12

yeah how how how does how does it incite that immune reaction what what does it do what what does it actually do

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:42:10 – 1:42:19

by it brings the immune cells um to recognize the covid protein

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:42:19 – 1:42:44

how how how how does it have the are are you aware of the fact that the lipid nanoparticle delivers its modified mrna to a cell that mrna that modified mrna is injected into the cell and then it turns the cell into a factory of the spike protein which is toxic to the body are are you aware that that's how it creates immunity

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:42:44 – 1:42:54

The mRNA in the vaccine does get into cells and it codes for a protein, um, once it is inside the cell.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:42:54 – 1:42:56

So, are are you aware of the DNA contamination

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:42:58 – 1:42:58

I am not

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:42:58 – 1:43:08

found in in the in these vials that if if the mRNA is being injected in the cell, well, gee, gee, maybe some of this DNA, which is way beyond the levels, accepted by the FDA, could also be injected in the cell. Are you aware of that?

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:43:09 – 1:43:22

I I am aware that the mRNA that is injected does not get into our own DNA. And I am not aware of reliable data saying that within the vaccine itself, that the DNA levels are high.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:43:22 – 1:43:36

So you you said that there is no clinical evidence proving these injections cause cancer. How would you What would you require for proof? How would you ever prove that?

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:43:38 – 1:44:13

I believe that we can put some boundaries around how much of an effect could be happening with respect to causing or accelerating cancer, because we have not seen an overall increase in cancer rates in the vaccinated U S population. In order to prove it, we would need a randomized clinical trial where patients were equal in both arms. One would have a placebo or no vaccine. and uh the other would get the vaccine. And we would need to follow long term.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:44:13 – 1:44:15

So so so observational studies,

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:44:13 – 1:44:14

We

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:44:15 – 1:44:20

you know, clinical observation carries no weight, ha- has no evidence.

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:44:20 – 1:44:29

I think it's hypothesis generating. I do think there are major differences between people who choose to have vaccines, who are more health engaged, and those who choose not to.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:44:29 – 1:44:49

Well I I was uh uh sent a apparently a study that's gonna be discussed in the June eighth and ninth uh Present cancers, present cancer panel by the chairman Harvey Risch. And apparently the, and I don't know what this stands for, the USCier, C or SEER.

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:44:49 – 1:44:53

Surveillance and epidemiologic evidence uh registry.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:44:51 – 1:46:09

Thank you. C SEER is actually easy to say. Um, this is what Doctor Risch wanted me to talk about this. Leukemias are generally the shortest latency cancers and thus would be the first empirical science to see pandemic related effects. USC or cancer incidence data for twenty twenty three were recently released. It is clear that for twenty twenty three there are substantial incidence increases above the trend line for all. Bo- both sexes, males, uh both sexes, uh for for every cohort. They have in you know s in instant increases above the trend line. These charts appear to be the first US data showing that in association to the COVID-nineteen infection and vaccination of leukemias, may be possible and should be confirmed by additional data as they become available. Again, I think it's pretty pretty balanced statement, but you know, w- we have uh, you know, the Doctor El-Diri who has just laid out plausible mechanisms, you know, concerned. We have Doctor Dalgish who saw it in his clinic, who was highly concerned. Uh, again, I I hear from a lot of doctors also see it clinically, observationally. Um, you know, Doctor El-Diri talked about uh the cancer's seeing, you know, At the s- at the site, at the, in the neck. I mean, w- wouldn't that be indications of causation? Is that something that we ought to research?

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:46:10 – 1:46:33

I do believe that we should research this. I think it's because there may be some biologic plausibility, because we've seen single cases where a cancer is, um, diagnosed immediately after a vaccine or in the region. That doesn't mean it began developing at that exact point in time. distinguished between when it developed and when it was diagnosed.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:46:34 – 1:47:14

So so let me address the the other belief where you thought it just stayed in the arm. Uh there literally was biodistribution studies in rats that said the lanin the lipid nanoparker would biodistribute all over the body. You know accumulate in ovaries and adrenal glands that type of thing. So so we we do know now that they lied to us it was gonna stay in the arm. No it biodistributed all over the body. And in doing so then this little package with modified MRNA that wasn't gonna degrade, it's gonna enter cells all over the body, in the heart, uh, turning those little heart cells into manufacturers of a toxic spike protein that, then what does the body do when there's a toxic spike protein on a cell?

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:47:16 – 1:47:21

Well, I would first of all argue that what happens in mice is not necessarily what happens in humans.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:47:21 – 1:47:43

No, no, no, no, no. This this happened in humans. OK, we, again, they knew it before. They knew that when they lied to us, it was gonna say they knew it was gonna bio-distribute. That's the point of the the study in mice. They knew it. And now we know it because this is disturbing. One final question. Does it does it concern you as it concerns my other uh cancer doctors here, oncologists, that spike protein is being found in tumors?

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:47:45 – 1:48:06

I think we need to further investigate this, explore it, look at how common this is. And I am a scientist. I do believe that we should research, do the research, and have definitive proof, not single cases or population data where the populations are different.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:48:04 – 1:48:11

There there is, I would say there is no such thing as definitive proof and we'll get to that later after uh, Senator Blumenthal.

Sen. Blumenthal (CT)1:48:11 – 1:49:03

Thanks, Mr. Chairman. Uh, Doctor Grelow, uh, you are the Chief Medical Officer and Executive Vice President for the Association for Clinical Oncology and your professor you're a clinician and your organization uh represents more than fifty thousand oncology professionals who care for people with cancer and your testimony and by the way i'm sorry i wasn't here personally but i have read it a couple of times uh is that uh there is quote no clinical evidence proving that mrna covid-nineteen vaccines cause cancer." End quote. That's the predominant view of the fifty thousand medical professionals who were part of your association, correct?

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:49:06 – 1:49:15

Correct, and it's also a statement on our own US National Cancer Institute's website, a direct quote from the NCI's website.

Sen. Blumenthal (CT)1:49:15 – 1:49:46

And your testimony, based on scientific evidence, now is that rna i'm quoting breaks down quickly in the body and does not enter a person's dna in other words mrna cannot cause gene mutations end quote correct so whatever the need for more research that's the science that exists right now correct

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:49:46 – 1:49:48

that is that is the science

Sen. Blumenthal (CT)1:49:48 – 1:50:09

And that's the science that ought to guide clinicians, and does now in fact, guide them in prescribing vaccines for people who suffer from cancer tragically. Uh, because COVID-19 doesn't help them if they suffer from both cancer and COVID-19, does it? COVID-19 just weakens them.

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:50:10 – 1:50:25

We, we have good data that cancer patients who are generally more vulnerable, they have weakened immune systems from their therapies. those who got vaccinated in a couple of different registries did better had better survival than those who did not

Sen. Blumenthal (CT)1:50:26 – 1:50:56

um the tremendous advances that you describe in your testimony and you've just come back from a major conference so you're about as up to date as possible uh developing individual personalized immunotherapy uh based on mrna as a platform is the result of scientific research that goes back years correct maybe decades

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:50:57 – 1:51:04

that's what led to the development of the covid vaccine so we were researching mrna vaccines to treat cancer

Sen. Blumenthal (CT)1:51:04 – 1:51:12

the developers of the covid vaccine covid-nineteen vaccine were standing on the shoulders of that basic research

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:51:12 – 1:51:12

correct

Sen. Blumenthal (CT)1:51:12 – 1:51:31

so in your opinion how I wanna ask this as objectively as possible. How impactful is the administration's decision, ending research grants for NIH or other government agencies on basic science to the health of this nation?

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:51:33 – 1:52:36

I think um decreasing research funding is a threat that will slow down progress. It will slow down the United States' preeminence as the hub for research, a really respected hub for cancer research. Um, ideas like the, you all heard, I'm sure it was on the front page of the papers, this new RAS inhibitor, um, that's a major breakthrough for pancreatic cancer. That started with basic research funded by the National Cancer Institute, then taken into industry, a home run, I called it a grand slam, uh, uh, for pancreatic cancer that's applicable to lung cancer, colon cancer. That is the kind of basic research everybody said, this RAS target is undruggable. You could have said, then let's not investigate it, let's stop, it it's undruggable. But basic research funding from our government is what pushed ahead and found a workaround and find a found a way that's going to majorly impact.

Sen. Blumenthal (CT)1:52:34 – 1:52:39

And and and stopping it, stopping it will cost lives. Correct?

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:52:39 – 1:52:39

Sorry.

Sen. Blumenthal (CT)1:52:40 – 1:52:44

stopping this research will cost lives.

Julie Gralow (Witness)1:52:44 – 1:52:45

absolutely

Sen. Blumenthal (CT)1:52:46 – 1:53:28

miss felder um i wanna thank both you and doctor graylow for being here today but particularly yourself in sharing your personal story um you've had the opportunities to watch some of the administration's shifts in the c. d. c.'s main vaccine advisory panel uh when it comes to the uh h. p. v. vaccine uh what do you think is likely to happen to cervical cancer rates in this country if these baseless attacks on h. p. v. vaccine continue

Tamika Felder (Witness)1:53:30 – 1:53:41

sadly more people will die and when we look at this two decades for now It will be horrendous. And we also know that that HPV vaccine protects from more than just cervical cancer.

Sen. Blumenthal (CT)1:53:42 – 1:54:25

And you have been through that moment. When a doctor says to you, and I can't claim to quote what your doctor said to you, but in effect, I have some news I need to tell you, and We think you'll be OK, but this is serious, and here's the diagnosis. How does it make you feel, or how would it make you feel, if you knew that these vaccines that could have saved a lot of lives, including maybe yours, are being attacked?

Tamika Felder (Witness)1:54:27 – 1:54:57

Honestly, it's infuriating at some points because no one in the United States of America should die. of cervical cancer. But yet, as I read just a few names, people are dying of it. And while we have other countries, Rwanda, Scotland, Australia, who are working towards cervical cancer elimination, Denmark, there's no reason that the United States of America should be lagging so far behind.

Sen. Blumenthal (CT)1:54:59 – 1:55:21

And, uh, there's no reason we should be in lagging competition with other countries but most important that we should forego any kind of treatment or discourage people with myth and misinformation from seeking treatment that may save their lives. Correct?

Tamika Felder (Witness)1:55:21 – 1:55:30

we we have to really get a handle on the misinformation because misinformation causes more deaths and we have to stop that

Sen. Blumenthal (CT)1:55:30 – 1:55:32

Well Thank you very much. I apologize

Tamika Felder (Witness)1:55:31 – 1:55:32

You're welcome.

Sen. Blumenthal (CT)1:55:33 – 1:55:46

to the panel and and uh, Mister Chairman, to you. I have a hearing of the Veterans Affairs Committee. I'm the ranking member there, and I I really apologize, but I wanna thank you for being here today. Thank you.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:55:47 – 1:56:15

Good. Thank you, uh, ranking member Blumenthal. Uh, misinformation. Let's talk about one of the great lies told during COVID. It's been repeated now here a number of times. This is not normal MRNA. This is modified, so of the of the five uh of my five witnesses, who who's best qualified to describe exactly what the MRNA was in these injections? Doctor Elodiri.

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)1:56:16 – 1:56:23

Um, so the um, the MRNA is uh modified with Pseudo Pseudouridine.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:56:23 – 1:56:24

Actually got that right.

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)1:56:23 – 1:56:35

Um, uh, this won the Nobel Prize a couple of years ago. Uh, and it was a way to make MRNA stable, cuz MRNA

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:56:35 – 1:56:52

No, it didn't degrade. This doesn't degrade in days. I mean, I, my my staff is just, and we'll we'll enter this study in the record, showed me the study that I, seven hundred days. It was studied and found still circling the body. So that's that's seven hundred days. That's close to two years. And they they haven't extended the study beyond that. But go ahead.

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)1:56:54 – 1:57:30

So I I think more more research needs to be done about the mechanisms of uh persistence uh but it was unexpected along with a number of of other uh things that were observed after the uh vaccines um were rolled out and um so you know so you mentioned biodistribution um uh the contaminants that you mentioned dna and some plasmids are as

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:57:30 – 1:57:32

including sv forty correct

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)1:57:32 – 1:57:53

sv forty origin enhancer sequences not the full sv forty uh sequence but when the sv forty enhancer promoter sequences if they find their way into the human genome they can drive uh oncogenes Um, yeah.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:57:53 – 1:58:08

So if if they're contained in that lipid nanoparticle, and the nano lipid nanoparticle allows the transfection of the mRNA into the cell, this DNA contaminant can enter the cell as well, correct?

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)1:58:10 – 1:58:11

The lipid nanoparticle.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:58:10 – 1:58:37

So certainly possibilities. It's certainly like no clinical proof. Talk talk talk to me about that. I mean, i- i- is there literally ever definitive proof this is by the way this is driving me nuts as we talk to people in the you know fda the nih uh cdc that turn a blind's eye toward the safety signals they were screaming at them and they're always they always go back to well we didn't have definitive proof

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)1:58:38 – 1:58:56

so i i i will say that a number of different laboratories and scientists including i think one at the fda that uh published a report and you know finding the uh dna was was not very hard i mean a bunch of high school students did it over the summer

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:58:56 – 1:58:59

they did it was high school students correct

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)1:58:56 – 1:59:00

uh um

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:58:59 – 1:59:01

it literally was i mean they were using high school students

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)1:59:03 – 1:59:57

and um so but the um other uh scientists who found this and and reproduced it in different labs with different files published papers uh doctor kevin mckernan doctor david speicher uh, doctor jess uh rose um published a paper that looked at many vaccine vials over a number of years and documented high levels and they compared moderna and and pfizer lots and found mmm much higher levels than the fda threshold which was developed or uh uh you know, uh, put into effect decades ago for naked DNA, not DNA that's wrapped in in lipid nanoparticles that will take the DNA into the human cells.

Sen. Johnson (WI)1:59:58 – 2:00:37

Dr. Dalglish, you look like you wanna add add to something, yeah, trying to address the definitive proof. Cuz if if that's what's required, we'll never warn the public about possible dangers. Right? I mean, I I always thought personally that the fda's role was to search for safety signals that's why using these incredibly sophisticated algorithms and you know this mass database you know looking for the small little safety signals so that they could understand that so they could warn the public they could warn medical doctors they denied the safety signals and then as we talked to him well it wasn't definitive proof so we we couldn't go to the american public without definitive proof so talk a little bit about that

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)2:00:37 – 2:01:49

thank you very much the problem is is that people thought they understood rna so-called vaccines. RNA is a natural messenger in the body and it lasts about twenty seconds before it's gobbled up. So if you were to insert that, it would never be there long enough to induce an immune response. So what they had to do was make it and put a structure in it, that's the Pseudouridine, so that it would last a bit longer. And they told us that it would go to the arm and it would be gone in forty eight hours. And just to sum up what we're hearing is this is anything but the truth, because the important part here is the LNP, the liposomal nanoparticle, because that takes it into the center of the nucleus, whereby it can get inserted. And the thing about RNA, it it is like herding cats, you cannot tell it where to go, where to insert. And remember I sat on the board of a company developing these things, particularly for cancer and essentially we realized that all the evidence is you will never be able to harness these things.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:01:49 – 2:01:51

Because you couldn't control where it went, correct?

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)2:01:49 – 2:02:43

Uh Cannot, you cannot control the production. And just to point out how dangerous this is, this spike protein, which every single manufacturer of vaccines chose as their antigen, and which I was the first to point out, it will be highly dangerous because eighty percent homologous to human epitopes, the um autoimmune responses would be awful, and a hundred and thirty-one have been reported to the FDA. So you have to accept this is an extremely dangerous thing to have pouring out of your body continually year after year and you bring forward the chances of every chronic disease you've got which is why those of us who've looked at the data years and years of developing and making vaccines safe, et cetera, have said, no, it cannot be done. And I rest rest my case on that.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:02:43 – 2:04:13

But but there's no proof. Now, was this the second medical professional doctor witness that the Democrats have brought in here that did not understand that this was not true MRNA? I just find that shocking. And this is, yeah, I I knew this from the beginning. I'm not a doctor. You know, I I was schooled in what this mechanism was. That's why there's no way I was ever gonna get that injection. I didn't need definitive proof that it could cause harm. I thought this is dangerous. Th this is something I don't wanna deal with at all. And now we just have these medical professionals that are relying on studies. I I wanna get to this, cuz this the big part of this hearing is how corrupted science has become. Does it surprise any of you who have been attacked because you've conducted research as a study? outside the narrative that that, you know, disproves the fact, for example, that the MRNA is not true MRNA, that the studies that show that it has no problems, those things get funded, right? Think anybody would tax those? Talk talk talk about the Surgisphere study. That that tanked hydroxychloroquine during the midst of the pandemic, when we were just literally We should have been doing everything we could to treat the disease. You know, Doctor Hauser, you're I think you're familiar with the Surgesphere s study that uh t- to- totally bogus data

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:04:13 – 2:04:14

But that was

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:04:13 – 2:04:18

had to be retracted, but didn't really hear much of a hue and cry in the press, did we?

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:04:18 – 2:05:59

No, and in fact, it was a fraudulent study that was written by a non-medical. And uh the media went crazy to destroy hydroxychloroquine and create the narrative that hydroxychloroquine was dangerous, when hydroxychloroquine was given to millions of people with arthritis before and we never had any problems. And all of a sudden, the study comes out of nowhere and starts quoting patients that had COVID in Australia. Australia didn't even have COVID at the time that the paper was published. So, you know, this is the problem. You have these papers that are coming out, they get into these fancy journals. It was an embarrassment for the Lancet, frankly, because it started waking up physicians that we cannot trust. the medical literature. That was the first for me. Remember, I come from the world of clinical trials. You know, and as a clinical trial doctor, my number one thing is, sir, yes, we look at is the drug better than placebo? But ultimately, we also look at serious adverse events, and we also look at signals that tell us this is wrong. There were so many things that happened during the pandemic that, you know, it changed me. as a physician that was doing clinical trials because all of a sudden, I'm like listening to this, the the the vaccine stays in the deltoid, nothing stays in the deltoid. You know, especially in the microbiome space, you get to see that anything you put on your skin, you put a a a topical product on your skin, it c- it has a potential of killing your microbiome. You know, the skin has blood vessels, has nerves, muscles behind underneath. So, nothing that you inject or put topical just

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:06:01 – 2:06:06

Plus, plus isn't it true the lipid nanoparticle was literally designed to permeate,

Julie Gralow (Witness)2:06:04 – 2:06:05

Yes.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:06:06 – 2:06:10

permeate difficult, permeate it was designed to do that. So they knew that.

Julie Gralow (Witness)2:06:10 – 2:06:11

Yes.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:06:11 – 2:06:14

And they lied to us. That's that's why we don't have trust in science.

Julie Gralow (Witness)2:06:14 – 2:06:15

Well, that was

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:06:14 – 2:06:25

But we also don't, by the way, we also don't have trust in science because of who funds it. No, Dr. Greila, I have to ask, who funds your organization? Who who's the major funder of your society?

Julie Gralow (Witness)2:06:26 – 2:06:40

Our society is funded by membership by registrations to our meetings by industry sponsorship of our meetings, um by our journal subscriptions uh from non-profits um and individuals

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:06:41 – 2:06:41

and big pharma

Julie Gralow (Witness)2:06:42 – 2:06:44

that was the that's the industry

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:06:42 – 2:06:46

millions and millions and millions of dollars from big pharma

Julie Gralow (Witness)2:06:47 – 2:06:51

it goes to support our meetings or our journals

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:06:50 – 2:07:18

right i know you get millions and millions just like the media gets billions of dollars from big pharma so they don't don't do investigative journalism on the vaccine injuries. You know, Miss Felder, as a survivor of cancer, wouldn't you like to know if there's a chemical or something in the environment, or a drug or a vaccine that would increase your chance of getting cancer? Wouldn't you like to know that?

Tamika Felder (Witness)2:07:18 – 2:07:19

Absolutely.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:07:19 – 2:08:06

So, do you know, Dr. Grillo, d Again, I believe, and I just wanna do you agree, do you agree that the FDA and the CDC, their job after giving emergency use authorization for something or proving something, and they're doing safety surveillance, isn't their job to look at all the data and try and suss out, try, you know, try and determine wh where are those safety signals that we might miss? You know, without our sophisticated models, I mean, we we've gotta find those safety signals so then we can put, for example, warnings on the health aler alert network. So to warn clinicians, be on the lookout for this, You know, in in case, you know, we're seeing more of this adverse reaction to Vioxx or to, OK? It shouldn't it be that way? Isn't that what the FDA ought to do?

Julie Gralow (Witness)2:08:06 – 2:08:07

Um,

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:08:08 – 2:08:08

Have have y- have you

Julie Gralow (Witness)2:08:08 – 2:08:11

post-approve post-approval surveillance is part of the FDA's job.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:08:11 – 2:08:14

Have have you read have you read our report from four weeks ago?

Julie Gralow (Witness)2:08:15 – 2:08:15

I have not.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:08:16 – 2:12:04

So, let me summarize it for you in the audience. On March first of two thousand twenty one, Peter Marks, head of CBER, that's the group the FDA that approves the approves vaccines and then does safety surveillance, was given a briefing by by Doctor Anna Scharfschmidt. She was one of their di data mining experts who was working with the inventor of the algorithm who worked with Oracle. So he was given a a multi-page briefing, some of his top lieutenants, that their algorithm that they're using to analyze VAERS was going to hide in mass safety signals. And quite honestly, it's very easy to see why, because prior to the COVID injections, we had on average about two hundred eighty deaths per year reported to VAERS associated with the vaccine. Twenty twenty one is twenty one thousand. About ten again, r- roughly equal, this is just an i so let's say there's ten thousand deaths associated with the Pfizer vaccine ten thousand deaths associated with Moderna and then two hundred eighty deaths with all the vaccines if you look at VA if you look at Pfizer and compared to Moderna so ten thousand Pfizer compared to Moderna ten thousand two hundred eighty Well, they're they're they're they're equally dangerous, but they're equally safe. Turn around, look at Moderna at ten thousand deaths, compare that to Pfizer ten thousand two hundred eighty. Equally dangerous, equally safe. So it's obvious to me how how that algorithm, when you've got such an unusual situation, two distinct injections, but compared against each other, like like comparing arsenic to to hemlock. That you'd hide the safety signals. So he was warned that he was gonna hide them. Twenty six days later, Dr. Scharfsman did a dad run with a new algorithm, up to date, that didn't hide it, didn't max. It showed that the use system they were using was had forty nine cases of severe masking. Then they show them twenty five safety signals. Put up put up the put up the chart here. This is the this is the first list. OK? So you've got sudden cardiac death. You've got Bell's palsy. You have pulmonary infarction. You've got stroke. You got basal gargleal stroke. Lot of things I can't pr I mean, this is serious stuff. Senior officials of the FDA were shown this. For three se consecutive months, they kept doing more data runs, showing more cases of different types of sudden death. So again, I I would think the FDA officials go, you know, thank you, Doctor Shorstman, man. Thank you, God bless you, for for alerting us to this thing so we can alert the the doctors, the medical establishment. You think that's what they did? No. They told her to buzz off. They told her to cease and desist. It's not your job. Go away. You're a pest. And they continued to use that algorithm that they knew were hiding safety signals. So they could go to the American public to this day and lie to them and say, well, we just weren't seeing safety signals. Yeah, they saw them. They just closed their eyes. And now when we talk to them, this is I'm asking you because you said there's no proof. When we talk to the the people involved in this, that's their excuse. But this wasn't definitive proof. So, Doctor Mhaltra. Is there ever definitive proof? I mean definitive. I mean abs- like we, no doubt. Uh, I suppose if you shoot something in the brain, that's pretty, you know, there's definitive proof how that person died. But medically, when you, you, when you die from all ki- you have all kinds of, you know, what would you actually die from? It's, it's kind of hard, isn't it?

Aseem Malhotra (Witness)2:12:04 – 2:12:31

Yeah, I mean, when you make a diagnosis in medicine, you go on the, on the strength of the evidence. It's very difficult to get complete and total proof. I mean, look at what happened with Big tobacco, smoking and lung cancer. The first evidence that emerged that there was a link between smoking and lung cancer, uh, until there was actually regulation curbing tobacco consumption. It took fifty years because the tobacco industry launched a campaign to deny the, you know, the the smoking caused lung cancer. They put out research to counter it.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:12:30 – 2:12:33

And did the tobacco industry, they buy a lot of ads on TV?

Aseem Malhotra (Witness)2:12:34 – 2:12:35

Maybe they did, yeah.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:12:35 – 2:12:38

Did did they possibly fund medical associations?

Aseem Malhotra (Witness)2:12:35 – 2:12:40

I think they did, yeah. So, so on that,

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:12:39 – 2:12:41

So again, there is, you know,

Aseem Malhotra (Witness)2:12:40 – 2:12:40

yeah.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:12:41 – 2:12:43

m- history maybe doesn't repeat itself, but it sure rhymes.

Aseem Malhotra (Witness)2:12:43 – 2:14:48

But but I think on that topic as well, Senator Johnson, I think there's a few um There are a few real truths that people to, need to understand to bust some myths here. First of all, medicine is not an exact science. We keep hearing this, you know, Anthony Fauci uses term trust the science, trust the science. And when I heard that, I thought that's the most unscientific statement I've ever heard in my life. Because medicine is an applied science. It's a social science. It's constantly evolving. The father of the evidence-based medicine movement, David Sackett said, fifty percent of what you learn in medical school will turn out to be either outdated or dead wrong within five years of your graduation, the trouble is nobody can tell you which half. So you have to learn to learn on your own. So that's one thing you have to understand. But what that means is it's open to manipulation. And if you look at the current status of the medical industrial complex, we have this, you know, misinformation mess, to quote John Ioannidis, Professor of Medicine at Stanford, the most cited medical researcher in the world. Twenty seventeen he wrote his paper, How to Survive the Medical Misinformation Mess. And he points out that twenty to fifty percent of all healthcare activities brings no benefit to the patient, is wasteful or harmful. And why, what is the main root cause of that problem? Because most doctors are unaware of the poor quality research that di- drives their clinical decision making. The pharmaceutical companies, they direct the agenda, they design the the trials, they analyse their own research, they then give, you know, um, uh, summary results of their research to the regulators such as the FDA and in the UK, the MHRA. But the problem we've got now, is that there's no open transparency and independence because fifty to sixty five percent of the funding of the FDA comes from big pharma in the UK eighty six percent of the funding comes from big pharma so what you've created is really a misinformation mess with biases all the way through down to the you know what happens in the consultation room and ultimately what happens is you have an exaggerated safety and benefit invariably of almost every single drug you know, that has uh come on the market and that's the real problem, the root the root cause of this issue they're trying to deal with.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:14:48 – 2:15:05

So, Doctor El-Diri, I'm I'm gonna put up a a chart that was inside of a exhibit you'd presented to us. Um, again, you you've been around for quite a few years. You know, Doctor Grillo, do you, are you familiar with Doctor El-Diri in the in the cancer field?

Julie Gralow (Witness)2:15:06 – 2:15:14

Absolutely, and um, I actually serve on the scientific advisory group for his win consortium for precision oncology.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:15:14 – 2:15:19

So would you consider him a highly respected oncologist and cancer researcher?

Julie Gralow (Witness)2:15:20 – 2:15:22

I have always respected doctor. I'll do it.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:15:23 – 2:15:55

Well, somebody on pub here doesn't. So, doctor, why don't you quick explain what what this chart shows and and again the the relationship to when you started publishing things like, oh, uh, maybe the the origin of of of the coronavirus maybe isn't holding true. you know, maybe that was man-made. Uh, is that about when that happened, about twenty twenty four, and all of a sudden you started getting all these requests for, uh, information on, on your past studies? Just, just kind of describe the torment you've gone through.

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)2:15:56 – 2:16:49

So, back in twenty twenty, um, a paper was published in Nature Medicine in, around April, uh, and, uh, it, it, it has become controversial in terms of pointing to the origins. Uh, uh, that, that is when attacks started on, on social media. But, um, we did some COVID research and, you know, right from the beginning, as I said earlier, we know viruses cause cancer. Um, the, the COVID virus, uh, needs to be studied for its links to cancer. And and the COVID virus uh vaccine makes the spike protein. Now there's a a difference between COVID and HPV. The HPV vaccine.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:16:49 – 2:16:50

What's a vaccine?

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)2:16:50 – 2:16:51

It helps people.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:16:51 – 2:16:53

COVID is is literally gene therapy.

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)2:16:52 – 2:16:59

But but in the case of HPV, you're not vaccinating with E six. E six targets P fifty three.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:16:59 – 2:17:06

OK. But again, address the the ramp up of attacks on you. Give me a timeline in terms of you you publish something.

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)2:17:04 – 2:17:05

Right. So so

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:17:06 – 2:17:07

all of a sudden these attacks begin.

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)2:17:07 – 2:17:25

So, twenty twenty four, we published some preliminary data that, uh, if you overexpress the spike protein in human cells, you attenuate, you block the tumor suppressor, P fifty three. This is the most common tumor suppressor.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:17:25 – 2:17:29

And and and big pharma wouldn't like that, right? So so all of a sudden you start getting attacks.

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)2:17:28 – 2:17:29

So

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:17:29 – 2:17:31

I mean, the keep keep going with the

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)2:17:30 – 2:18:25

But, we we said, maybe if you wanna develop uh uh good vaccine, boost the immune system against the virus, but limit collateral damage to the host defenses. That shouldn't be controversial. Attacks started and continued. And then uh by the middle of uh twenty um twenty five, I was invited to serve on an HHS committee. I was doing government service to look into p- plausible links And uh, found a bunch of things that are worth uh, studying more. And the attacks took off. We published that work. Uh, by January, the journal where the article was published came under a cyber attack. Nobody in the world could access this paper for at least a week. Um.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:18:25 – 2:18:36

Again, the, this is when I was connected with you and I started hearing just your, I mean, look, I would call it torment. Th- they, you've been tormented. They're trying to destroy your career. They're doing a pretty good job at it, aren't they?

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)2:18:36 – 2:19:12

I'll say a couple of things. You know, um, all of these mounting concerns, uh, look, look concerning. They're piling up. What's going on? Most of them are trivial, in my view. I mean, one case was a typographical error in a supplementary table. where we were looking at what does the body produce in people who have severe covid and we spelled the word intubation it's spelled as incubation if you read that that's a concern and the the

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:19:12 – 2:20:41

i want i want to keep going here but i i would i'm gonna enter in the record a a blog post by marianne de mace uh that really kind of describes this pretty succinctly the gory detail of of the torment you've been going through um without objection nobody's gonna object uh i also wanna make sure i i Enter in the record that Dr. Harvey Risch, the SEER, whatever that stands for, that study. Uh, one thing I'd recommend to anybody watching this, and these all be posted on our website too. There was a uh a substack piece written by a Midwestern doctor today. You know, he's aware of this hearing. Uh, put up the uh Put up that one. Uh, th- this is called Again, he's doing it for this hearing. They rigged clinical trials, or how they rigged clinical trials, And the, and the price we all pay for it. I mean, that's, I think that's the point. Say, listen, I, I, I feel sorry for you doctors who are paying a very high price for being attacked because you're you're trying to convey the truth, you're, you're trying to do real science, which is skeptical. Trying to poke the holes in the consensus, right? Um, but the people who really pay is patients. We, we don't have a clue. I mean, the lies told to the public, that, that's why a growing percentage of Americans simply don't trust doctors, would avoid the hospital Like a plague, which by the way that'll be a hearing we'll have as the hospital protocols. Um, but this this caught my eye in in this piece right here. Uh, this is, what kind of chart is this called? There's a name for this. Pardon?

Julie Gralow (Witness)2:20:41 – 2:20:42

A forest plot.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:20:42 – 2:22:22

There you go. Yeah, forest plot. And so thi- this shows all the different types of drugs that people studied to treat COVID. And what's noteworthy about this, if you look at everything that has a red uh circle around it or a uh you know a a a red dotted deal wasn't they they were either in the guidelines or the red dotted rectangles they were in the guidelines and what's notable about them is i'll just go down the list i can't pronounce them casavir twenty one hundred bucks the other one's twelve hundred dollars the next one's eight hundred fifty five bucks the next one is twelve hundred dollars then paxlovid five hundred twenty nine dollars Sotrovibor- whatever, twenty one hundred dollars, Mold- Molenpiravir, seven hundred bucks. Remdesivir. By the way, that's what doctors, what nurses call that is run, death is near, cuz it knocks out your kidneys. But thirty one hundred and twenty dollars. Um. Com- OK, uh, last one's five thousand bucks. But what's interesting is that with the forest plot, uh, you get to Actually, diet has a fifty percent efficacy. Every- everything else below that is below fifty percent efficacy. You know, ivermectin's up there at sixty-two percent with ninety-nine different studies. Hundred thirty-seven thousand patients. But again, this this shows the corruption within our medical system. You know, random control trials, who who who can afford to to run those? Doctor Hazen, I mean, you you you you spend a lot on trials, I mean, who can r- You do a lot you do a lot of, I would consider more observational trials, correct? I mean,

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:22:21 – 2:22:22

Or

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:22:22 – 2:22:24

ones using, you know, ends of N equals one or whatever.

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:22:25 – 2:23:14

Uh, well, right now, cuz I've kind of switched my um my ways into looking more at the microbiome, but I mean, there was a time I was doing clinical trials for pharmaceutical companies and, yes, pharmaceutical companies pay a lot of money to do clinical trials. And, um, what most people don't know and what the public doesn't know is that you don't know what's impacts lovid. For all you know, it's a couple of drugs that are off label on the market, but it's a trade secret. And the problem with that is that now they can bring that trade secret into the public at a high price. So who controls that price really? If you look at the stock market, you know, you want who's investing in these pharmaceutical companies? These stock, these stocks, you know, it's all about the price of the stock.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:23:15 – 2:23:32

So so again, let's get back to your, you know, so you had published out what I consider pretty important papers, cuz you know again we were, you know, I I was you keep me up to date in terms of what you're doing. Pretty amazing stuff. I mean, you literally have nonverbal autistic children are talking. I've seen the videos, OK? And we couldn't do it cuz we couldn't pixelate the faces.

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:23:30 – 2:23:31

Yes.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:23:32 – 2:23:38

But you you've got a bunch of patients that you've treated with different maladies ALS you're keeping ALS patients alive,

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:23:38 – 2:23:40

Yes, four and a half years.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:23:39 – 2:23:54

OK? Um But yet you're you were putting again these are FTA basically approved or monitored trials right? And you write the papers on it, goes through eight months of peer review. Why do you assume they were retracted?

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:23:56 – 2:23:56

Um

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:23:56 – 2:23:59

I mean, again, I don't there's probably no definitive proof,

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:23:59 – 2:24:00

You you can't

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:24:00 – 2:24:01

but I mean what what's your conjecture?

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:24:01 – 2:24:17

You can't make a business out of something that's published to the public unfortunately and uh you know pharmaceutical companies do spend a lot of money on clinical trials and they expect to make their money back on capital expenditures, right, that they've spent.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:24:17 – 2:24:30

Which which by the way, just to to plug the Midwestern doctor, read this article cuz it shows you how they how they doctor, you know, how they rig clinical trials. This is this is very interesting read, OK? So if you're watching the hearing, read this one.

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:24:31 – 2:24:36

I I've been in the clinical trial business, Senator, for three decades. I know all the tricks.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:24:36 – 2:24:38

I understand. That's why I'm asking you to convey a couple.

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:24:37 – 2:26:15

So Yes. So unfortunately, um, you know Good I've always stood by one thing, good drugs come out and bad drugs stay out, OK? When a research is done poorly, it's time to get that drug out of the market, OK? I I think we can all agree, as we still have COVID amongst us, COVID has not disappeared, that these vaccines have not done what they were supposed to do, right? They have not eradicated the virus, right? We still have COVID amongst us. So therefore we have to kind of look at, well how do we get better? How do we get better as society? How do we stop killing the microbiome and how do we improve the microbiome? You know, science is only as good as science is today, until the new technology comes along. But when you destroy the new technology that's trying to come out, that's trying to say, hey, look at me, I'm the microbiome, and you're suffocating that and you're censoring that, you're not allowing it to progress. and you just stop science. So you just alluded to my two twins that resumed speech after nine months of manipulating the microbiome to improve their microbiome, to get rid of the bad microbes, to improve their microbiomes. Do you know how many parents are asking me, can you publish that? I can't publish. Do you wanna know why I can't publish or tell the data? And I have to publish because if I have to conv- if I wanna convince my peers to do what I'm doing so they can reproduce the data, I have to publish. So I can't just be on social media and say, hey, look at what I need to do.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:26:15 – 2:26:16

So why why don't you publish it?

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:26:17 – 2:26:21

I can't publish. I've had four pa- you know, science is

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:26:20 – 2:26:22

Cuz they cuz they retract them.

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:26:22 – 2:27:09

But it's a story, right? You it's science is a story untold, right? Imagine you're reading a book and you wanna know the end of the story, but somebody removed chapter four and chapter eight from your story. It's no longer a story anymore. You've lost the characters. This is a, you know, the microbiome is a story. It's a story of discovery. It's a story of finding COVID in the stools. It's a story of discovering loss of bifidobacteria in severe COVID patients. It's a story of noticing that loss of bifidobacteria happened to be in invasive cancers. It's a story of the messenger RNA killing the bifidobacteria. Therefore, you have to ask questions, is the vaccine killing the bifidobacteria? Are these people low in bifidobacteria? And therefore, possibly getting

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:27:09 – 2:27:13

But again, my my my question was why do you think your studies were retracted?

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:27:14 – 2:27:15

It it

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:27:15 – 2:27:17

I mean, what what what powerful interests were you threatening?

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:27:18 – 2:27:19

Well, it's it's

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:27:19 – 2:27:20

I mean, who who didn't want your studies out there?

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:27:22 – 2:27:27

people that are benefiting from the price of the stock,

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:27:27 – 2:27:27

From from the,

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:27:27 – 2:27:31

or from pharmaceutical products developed.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:27:28 – 2:27:30

OK, from from the from the current from from the current

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:27:31 – 2:27:31

Yes.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:27:31 – 2:27:33

treatments that aren't curing the diseases, basically.

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:27:33 – 2:27:35

Yes. They they don't want precision medicine.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:27:33 – 2:28:48

By the way, just just real quick. This is one of the better charts, and this is from way back in twenty twenty one. Uh, the the blue lines looks like one great big blue blob. Those are daily new cases. And you you'll notice they peaked about January twenty twenty one, just as we started the uptake of the COVID injection. Now. The the the pandemic was definitely I'd call say petering out, right? Um, you would think if the injection was that effective, that would have just continued in Pandemic over, right? Um, that didn't happen. Now, I I do remember again contacting all these doctors that there were there were vaccinologists, immunologists that were saying that the worst thing you can do in the midst of a pandemic is do a mass vaccination. It was gonna drive variants. And so we had delta, then we had Omicron. I mean, I don't, is that what happened? I I do know probably that the people that were publishing those studies or those papers were probably attacked. they were dismissed. You know, kooks. But again, does that does that chart look like success of the injection? You know, Doctor Delgelish, what what do you what do you think of, uh, you know, what happened in terms of the different variants and

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)2:28:49 – 2:29:58

I I I think that chart says it all. Uh, I'd just like to point out that we suffered from people running this, uh, pandemic, the response to it, who clearly didn't understand basic aerosol uh respiratory diseases. They always go in cycles and uh in peaks and troughs till they peter out. So each following wave of infection gets less dangerous and sometimes more infectious like Omicron, but less of a problem. And one of the big mistakes that was made in handling of this pandemic is that so I speak from the English data which I know well. is we introduced lockdown just as the first wave was disappearing. So they they gave credit to the lockdown. They introduced the vaccine when the second wave was falling, hence the uh claim that they saved millions of lives, which is completely utter nonsense because it's only had that wave continued to go on and it's all computer modelling has been shown to be completely, utterly fallacious.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:29:58 – 2:35:19

So so let me show you a study that has not been attacked or or rebutted other than from me. And you you talked about saving millions of lives. You know, our ranking member here in couple couple of hearings ago, uh, and I'll enter this in the record. This is the uh the study from uh the uh Commonwealth Fund, claiming that uh in two thousand twenty one, two thousand twenty two, three point two million lives were saved. So I've got a si series of three charts here. So the first chart uh shows actual deaths through twenty nineteen Uh, compound anti-growth growth rate, this in the US, little under one percent. So if if again, population is growing or aging, so number of deaths per year, but it's going, you know, two point four up to about two point eight five in twenty nineteen. Um let's let's show what actually happened. So here, actual deaths through twenty twenty four. So obviously in twenty twenty went from about two point nine to three point four. About half a million people died during COVID without a vaccine. Now Again, I I would say the vaccine was effective, you know, particularly when new cases have pretty well plummeted by January of twenty twenty one. Uh, you'd see deaths go down in twenty twenty one. That's not what happened. We we had with three point five million deaths, came down a little bit more in twenty twenty two to three point three. So again, well, well, where are all these where's the three point two million lives saved? Next chart. You would have t in order to make this claim, In this completely BS paper. I mean, again, I I'm not a medical researcher. I mean, I'm not a troll on on PubPier. I'm I'm just a a lowly accountant who can do simple math and produce some charts. You would have to assume we were gone from two point eight five million deaths in two thousand nineteen. And expected five million deaths in twenty twenty one and twenty twenty two with a vaccine available is gonna end the pandemic. And this paper still stands. A United States senator used this as a proof. You know, n- no offense, but he b- he brings in doctors who believe the MRNA was actual MRNA, and not modified not to be degraded in the body. Don't have a clue that it's biodegradable to the body. Really doesn't understand the mechanism that could cause cancer. But again, they just make these, make these three point two million lives. I mean, obviously, you knuckleheads that are talking about vaccine injuries, you don't understand the benefit. Two, three point two million lives saved. How How can you spread this disinformation? I'm sorry, the disinformation's from the other side. So I said, I don't deny that vaccines can save lives. I'll deny that they save three point two million. There's no way. There's no way. And again, the point, the point being here, this study, because it conforms to the narrative. I'm sure Pfizer, Moderna love this study. Because they just got approved for another booster. Without any review of the vaccine, of the injection injuries. Not a review, ev- even though Aaron Siri begged them to, just look at it. Put put up put up the uh VAERS chart one with twenty one million deaths. Yeah, that one. So so th this this shows this shows VAERS The number of deaths reported of errors So see the vaccine going back to the start of errors in nineteen ninety. You can see through nite two thousand nineteen on average about two hundred and eighty deaths, I talked about that earlier. Two thousand twenty one, twenty one thousand deaths worldwide. Cur- currently the number is thirty nine thousand, I think thirty nine. And twenty four percent of those deaths occur on either the day of vaccination or within one or two days. Now, is that definitive? Did some of those people die within two days of something else other than the injection? Probably, maybe. But that would be something that would concern me. That'd be something as a regulator who was had the duty to surveil safety and warn the American public that maybe the American public should have been warned. But the American public wasn't. And again, they they published these studies. So, I mean, cert cert I mean, it's actually remarkable that the surge of fear was actually pulled down, but it it was so, I mean, the data was completely fraudulent. Listen, I I've I've got I have so many questions uh that I prepared for you guys. Um It it's it's really Again, I I don't know where where you begin when there's Our side gets, you know, I get accused, by the way, uh, there's not been one thing I've said during COVID that's been proven just wrong. I'll challenge your, I'll challenge any, you know, anything I've been saying since I've been vilified and ridiculed and there's not one thing and there may be a couple minor mistakes, but, you know, the major points I've made, all the conspiracy theories that I accused of, they're all true. But yeah, we we get accused of misinformation. You know, uh Doctor.

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)2:35:19 – 2:36:14

I just wanted to add in a couple of comments relative to what you were alluding to. But the obfuscation of the real data was an absolute disgrace throughout. Um, the the fact that it got approved on being effective on a relatively relative risk of ninety five percent when the absolute risk of O point eight four was ignored. And as a clinician, Uh, I want to know how many people do I have to vaccinate to have benefit? And it was a one in uh nearly a one in a hundred and uh eighteen. I mean, it's just not worth it. The second thing, when it comes to the side effects, that they basically said, well, we don't have side effects um for the vaccine until at least fourteen days, because that's how long it takes an antibody to come. So all the people who dropped down dead after one or two days went down on the list as unvaccinated because they are only include now I mention this because I know

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:36:14 – 2:36:16

It's it's how they rig clinical trials, right?

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)2:36:16 – 2:36:17

Yeah, yeah.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:36:16 – 2:36:17

That's how they rig them.

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)2:36:17 – 2:36:17

Yeah.

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)2:36:18 – 2:37:23

So, and with regards to the claims that there's uh that there's no link between the vaccines and cancer which we hear repeatedly like vaccines save millions of lives there are a couple of things one I don't know any other cancer cancer doctor except for a few colleagues once they wake up who actually ask for the link and uh we were told at medical school you have to ask for the drugs and the vaccines if you're dealing with a disease you don't want to to know. But one of the things which has been pointed out to me who who know about these things, the CDC in uh twenty four uh actually published, it was on the mainstream uh media, that there was eighteen million people severely disabled by the vaccine in America. I was amazed to see it's been updated this year to over thirty million. I mean, this is an it's continuing to rise, rise. and this is a result of the vaccine if you really want to know about the cancer and the vaccines the cdc i believe i am informed by people who know about these things they have separate registries surely they should be merged then we would have a much better idea

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:37:23 – 2:37:27

well first of all you're never gonna find proof when you don't look for proof right

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)2:37:27 – 2:37:28

absolutely

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:37:27 – 2:37:55

i mean i mean that's the problem is that they they they're not gonna fund the studies and they they close our eyes i mean it was shown them And they still denied it. Talk a little bit about, cuz I don't think we got an answer on this. Why is it significant that people with biopsies are seeing the spike protein in tumors? You know, why shouldn't they be there? Yes, to me it's not obvious. I I don't understand. I'm I'm asking a legitimate question here. Why is that concerning? Why do you find that so odd that there's spike protein in tumors?

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)2:37:54 – 2:37:54

It it

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)2:37:55 – 2:38:32

It's completely unexpected. It shouldn't be there, either from COVID infection or vaccine. How does it get there? what you know it's a foreign protein how does it end up in a tumor that's an expanding mass where the cells have this spike protein how does it get there what is it doing there why is it that it is six years later and there is very little forensic evidence people aren't looking in the deceased to see what is happening um And uh

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:38:32 – 2:38:44

By the way, could could part of the answer be because the modified RNA is still circulating in the body six years later, and when a tumor starts, it's still attaching themselves to cells and expressing spike protein? That that might be one plausible explanation, right?

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)2:38:44 – 2:38:58

Do you know what boggles the mind? When you talk about hepatitis, OK, people get hepatitis, we've got tests, we can see the hepatitis antigens, the antibodies, what happens to them. Six years later, there's no test for

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)2:38:59 – 2:39:01

Spike protein, for example, in the blood.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:39:00 – 2:39:21

Again, they didn't they didn't wanna know. T- talk about, cuz this is true, th- it was very rare to have autopsies during COVID, right? I kn- I know people who had loved ones die and they could not get an autopsy. I mean, who who can speak to that? And then and then also what coroners were seeing in terms of the the long white clots, uh, the microclotting, you know, doctor.

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)2:39:22 – 2:41:03

I I will spea- I can speak to that because I've saw some horrendous uh um hyperprogression of disease. It's a term that's been applied to people with certain checkpoint inhibitors. It's always there's a few of them. But we see this hyperprogression dramatically in patients who've had the boosters. And I've seen it in friends of mine and it's really disturbing. They don't even respond to classical therapy. And I tried very, very hard to fi- to get the uh tissue checked for spike protein. The no coroner would do it. And we went everywhere, no coroner would do this, so they've been clearly told from the top down. Now, while we're talking about a a a a test, it is very easy to measure uh spike protein in the blood. And I have been campaigning is that, you know, the the damage this uh continuous spike production does is so dangerous where it's going to keep going on and the cancer's going to keep getting worse and worse we need to be able to measure the spike protein simple test, which they deny and say is not needed, And then you can try some very simple things which we know help dissolve the, uh, the spike protein in the body, which natural processes don't do. And several of these are are available and they're quite cheap. Things like Natakinase, Lodosnaltrexone and Ivermectin, et cetera. Why aren't these studies being done and funded? Because they're so simple to do and they could save an awful lot of morbidity, because certainly in individual anecdotal cases, this works giving these things will bring the spiked protein down toxicity. So I think it should actually be a national program to to check this and sort this out.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:41:04 – 2:41:07

So, Dr. Greer, well, not not to pick on you, but, you know, why don't we conduct these studies?

Julie Gralow (Witness)2:41:09 – 2:42:08

Well, I'll tell you, I had an opportunity to talk to our NCI director, Doctor Tony Letai, this past week, knowing um, I'd be coming to this hearing, and he suggested um, we both support continued surveillance. We both support continued research in this. He suggested that the NCI has an ongoing CONNECT trial with two hundred thousand Americans who have not had cancer when they enter. And it's looking at causes of cancer and cancer prevention. There are lots of different cohorts with proposed different, um, potential causes of cancer, and this could be one. They're collecting blood, they're collecting tumor. So, he is very supportive. of studying this in an ongoing cohort of two hundred Americans, where they know everything about the patient's history. They're collecting blood. I don't know what, they're probably collecting other things. And then if they get cancer, they're collecting the cancer. So there is a mechanism that we've talked about where we could further study this.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:42:09 – 2:42:30

Do- Dr. Moser, I I know I wanted to ask you, cuz you you did your study, uh, claimed three million excess deaths. I mean, how did you how did you come up with your numbers? Again, try and keep it pretty high level and so we can understand it in pretty brief. And as loud as possible. I really can barely hear you. You gotta get the

Saskia Mostert (Witness)2:42:31 – 2:43:15

No. Uh, in our study we, uh, assessed excess mortality as the deviation between the reported number of deaths in a country during a certain week or month in two thousand twenty until two thousand and uh the expected number of deaths in a country for that period under normal circumstances for the baseline of expected deaths uh historical death data was used in a country thousand fifteen until two thousand nineteen and all course mortality reports were abstracted for countries of the western world our worlding database their reported number of deaths from the human mortality database and the world data set

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:43:15 – 2:43:18

and again all you do is publish your results

Saskia Mostert (Witness)2:43:16 – 2:43:18

and then yeah

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:43:18 – 2:43:28

and so we're not saying anything cause it's just some this is something that ought to be looked into and rather than look into it they attack you and you end up having to resign and

Saskia Mostert (Witness)2:43:28 – 2:43:28

yeah

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:43:29 – 2:43:33

find a new career i guess doctor you you uh dear you uh look like you wanted to say something

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)2:43:32 – 2:43:56

i i i wanna make a couple of points um and maybe um discuss this with doctor grello about uh a population signal versus uh a risks uh uh uh risk of developing cancer or other diseases so we know in medicine that

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:43:51 – 2:43:51

yeah

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)2:43:57 – 2:45:26

everybody has different risks and one of the questions that i think is important to answer is what is the specific patient's risk of side effects from the covid vaccine And what is the risk of cancer? Uh, however infinitesimal it is, it i- it would be. You know, the numbers really matter. Um, many decades ago, my daughter was born and she had a hypoxic brain injury during her birth. And nobody ever told me about what those risks were. Is it one in a hundred, one in a thousand, one in ten thousand? I didn't know, and I'm a doctor. And I have to live with those consequences for the rest of my life. If I knew there was a chance of this, that could have been prevented by a C-section, I would have had that done and my daughter could be a a beautiful person, functional in society. And so these these things are really important for the people who are harmed What are their risks? We know people have very different risks of developing cancer. It's six years later. The things need to be nuanced. What is the relationship with the number of shots as far as the effects of of of the vaccine? We need more

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:45:26 – 2:46:10

But but again, we're we're we're not getting those studies because the people who just put a simple study, here's some plausible net mechanisms how the spike protein could cause cancer, they're destroying your career. So it doesn't take a dictator very very many people to hang in the the uh city square before like people stopped behaving right and the same thing with the doctors been attacked their licenses were uh threatened, they were fired, they were sued that that's why you didn't have very many people treating doctors treating with ivermectin did you, doctor hazen i mean it's i mean how how many how many doctors do you know whose whose careers were destroyed because they they'd have the courage and compassion to try and treat patients with And we we showed, I mean, ivermectin was up there in terms of effectiveness.

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:46:12 – 2:46:17

Uh, uh, treat everybody.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:46:17 – 2:46:19

Oh, it's it's kind of hard to blame him, isn't it?

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:46:19 – 2:46:31

Very few doctors during the pandemic had the courage to treat, and I think partly because, yes, doctors are afraid of losing their licenses. And, um, and

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:46:31 – 2:46:34

But they, by the way, they often have two, three hundred thousand dollars' worth of debt.

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:46:34 – 2:46:36

Yeah, and then you're looking at

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:46:35 – 2:47:02

They they they have a family to take care of. They they they went through all they wanna continue to practice medicine because they they wanted people save people's lives like they saved my daughter's life with transverse degree arteries. And so I I I understand it, but it just shows you how effective the attacks are. It doesn't take Doesn't they don't have to make an example of too many people like doctor El Diry, or you, or doctor Mostert, or doctor Malhotra, right? It just doesn't it just it doesn't take many.

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:47:04 – 2:49:00

Here's the problem, in order to reach a cure, we need to have bravery and courage to practice medicine. And if we don't have courage, we can't treat. You know, I stood on the front line of COVID, uh, unaware, really at the beginning, I was kind of scared of the virus. And then I treated my first patient, my second patient, my third patient, my patient number one thousand, two thousand, and I'm still standing. And I learned something. I learned the microbiome. But I realized that I was trained to be in this. You know, I was trained as a physician to cross those roadblocks, to have courage, because I work with the FDA on mult- I've worked with the FDA on multiple protocols for pharmaceutical companies. So I've developed that courage to say, no, this is a serious adverse event, needs to be reported to the FDA, and that drug needs to be shut down. But not everybody, every doctor has that training, unfortunately. And it, by the way, for me to do those protocols of hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin, cost hundreds of thousands of dollars, which, you know, we paid, I paid, you know, and I I asked myself what, you know, that study of the vaccine pre and post that showed messenger RNA killed the microbiome? That was two Lamborghini Countach, right? Or two or whatever. But the fact is, I spent it and Today, I asked myself, what if I didn't spend it? Are we, were we supposed to get a vaccine every three months, the rest of our lives? Are we a bunch of sheep that are just going, you know, down the road and listening to pharma and nobody's questioning the data? Nobody's questioning, you know, what we're supposed to do, how to defend ourselves? I discovered the microbiome during the pandemic. It was the light at the end of the tunnel. It was hope. And without hope in medicine, we have no medicine.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:49:00 – 2:51:07

So part of the problem I, as I've seen over the last few decades here in America and I think in England, it's been longer, uh, with with uh national health care, but we used to have independent doctors. And, you know, the doctor has the primary responsibility of the patient, and they're they used to sit at the top of the treatment pyramid and practice medicine. By the way, I really did learn the the meaning of the word practice medicine with my daughter with transposition. Um, you know, she she had an arterial she had a atrial switch versus arterial switch cuz they hadn't practiced medicine enough to do it. But anyway, so doctors need to practice medicine, but right now they're being crushed at the bottom of the pyramid, cuz now they're all hired hands. Uh, the hospitals can fire them, they can sue them, they practice, they practice protocols handed down, not just not by the, but by people like Anthony Fauci, who'd out of the blue said, no, remdesivir is gonna be the standard of the care, even though the who said you shouldn't use remdesivir. And the nurses sure didn't wanna use it. But man, was it profitable for the, the hospitals, for the drug companies. Again, that that's what the American public has to understand, is the corruption of medicine, of medical education, of science, of medical, it's, it's been corrupted, and it's, it's awful. It's gotta be fixed. But the only way, the only way we fix it is if we own up to it, and we admit it. And that's that's really what this hearing's about, is let's come to terms with how broken this system is and how you're only gonna get the studies that's gonna confirm Big Pharma and their patentable drugs that have driven up the cost of healthcare, we're not curing diseases, we're treating it at a very high profit level. And I come from the private sector. When I first ran two thousand ten, my my campaign guys said, never say that again. I said, what? I'll I'll defend Big Pharma and Big Oil. What am I, am I the only one that wants a new life-saving drug? You know, so You know, we need medical researchers. We need drug companies to do this. But man, we we need, first and foremost, integrity restored to science because it doesn't exist. I don't think it exists anymore.

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:51:08 – 2:51:28

A- and by the way, that's the future. The future is actually robots replacing the doctors. So we've lost humanity. We've lost the ability to hold the hand of a patient. Think of what happened during COVID. We were putting gloves on people's hands. Because we were afraid, pe- doctors and nurses were afraid of touching these patients because we instilled fear.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:51:28 – 2:51:28

Yeah.

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:51:29 – 2:51:31

Because fear sells products.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:51:31 – 2:53:09

I I talked I talked to a senior senior surgeon, you know, older guy like me. Would be scared to death of undergoing surgery now. Cuz young surgeons, they don't touch patients anymore. They use robotics and stuff and just don't they ha- they haven't got the just depth, the skill of of feeling what you need to feel to be an effective surgeon. It's it's scary stuff. We we need to You know, h- here's what also is scary. And, Ms. Felder, you understand this, you know, being a cancer patient. Um, again, uh, h- having lost confidence kn- knowing how they sabotage early treatment with cheap cheap generic drugs, there there is a observational study, uh, actually, Doctor Harvey Rich is one of the authors, as is Peter McCulloch. Um, ho- and it's, uh, apparently two hundred, uh, cancer patients treated with ivermectin and benbenazole. So I've I've got some oncologists here. I mean, is that something you're willing to take a look at? Because trust me, I know people have cancer. And they are looking for anything other than the poison that chemo chemotherapy is. But you know, it might extend your life a little bit, but you know, and I know we're we're doing we're making some progress and stuff, but man, that's a nasty cure. Peop- people are begging for again, true science, take a look. I mean, are are some of these things effective? I mean, this this looks pretty effective, but I'll go to the oncologist here, doctor, I mean, is that something you think has promise or are there other, you know, peptide, I mean, I've heard all kinds of things here. You know, doctor, I think it's Brzezinski, uh, Kessler tried to destroy him, but he's still practicing down in uh, in in Texas. But just just talk about alternate treatments of cancer.

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)2:53:10 – 2:54:57

Well, one of the things about uh, uh, cancer is that what you can use is very limited to what big pharma are going to choose and do. And we know that it's not done for the net benefit of the patients, it's done for the benefit of the markets that they create. And I've heard three people from Big Pharma all tell me they're not interested in cures, they're interested in the markets. And that brings us to the tension of what the patients actually want. And the patients want sort of cheap non-toxic drugs that might work. And the most amazing thing is that if you look and scratch the surface, we have an enormous number of them that are really quite effective. And I make no bones about it, I'm very interested in low-dose naltrexone, which seems to enhance people with cancer to any other, chemotherapy, immunotherapy, et cetera. But there are many, many others out there, Artusinate, et cetera, that have been shown to have interesting anti-cancer activity. So they're re- been repurposed. And of course, the two big ones are Ivermectin and, uh, but people forget this, I, well, Ivermectin, we were told we were not to use it. Uh, certainly during the pandemic. Now we know why. Because it was the most effective, uh, drug by far, with a few, few, uh, uh, competitors. But it was so good, and in two extreme cases myself, I authorised it to be used. People did not want to go into hospital, even though they were breathless, because they were convinced they were going to die if they went in, and I think they were probably right. But within twenty-four hours, they were both much, much better, and then Pierre Corey, has written a beautiful book, the war and ivermectin. Now it looks like some of these people had cancer and that there is a real role for looking at these anti-parasite things.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:54:57 – 2:55:01

But do, but do they have a, I mean, I'll go, uh, doctor, do these therapies have a chance?

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)2:55:01 – 2:55:02

Hmm.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:55:02 – 2:55:06

I mean, with big pharma again demanding random control trials, you know, you forget the observational stuff,

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)2:55:05 – 2:55:05

Yeah.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:55:06 – 2:55:09

you know, only, only expensive, panical drugs.

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)2:55:08 – 2:55:28

I I stay open-minded. I mean, just up the road from here, Johns Hopkins. one of my colleagues has been looking at mibendazole for brain cancer. I mean, uh, these these agents do, uh, affect the immune system and we need to learn about them and and study them more.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:55:27 – 2:55:57

How how how are we how are we gonna do this? I mean, we're gonna make this available to to the people who just wanna try something different? I mean, I again, people are having I know they can't get these kind of treatments. They have to go to just a very few doctors who are willing to do it. I mean, the cancer centers won't do it. Is is that largely true? I mean, doctor Gralo, really not picking any now, I mean, what what can we do? I mean, is this something that your society is looking at? I mean, would they look at, you know, cheap generic drugs that uh don't have the type of toxicity that uh some of these chemotherapies have?

Julie Gralow (Witness)2:55:57 – 2:56:14

Um, I think this speaks to the role of the need to sustain federal funding. I agree, industry is not going to do those trials. They don't have a vested interest in it. These are cheap drugs. These are the kinds of dry oils that our government should fund.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:56:14 – 2:56:18

Uh, by the way, I completely agree as long as that funding isn't corrupted in some way, shape, or form, you know.

Julie Gralow (Witness)2:56:19 – 2:56:51

I will tell you that at last year's big annual meeting, um, we had very preliminary data in a subset of breast cancer, looking at an immune checkpoint inhibitor with ivermectin added. It showed there were some responses. It did not prove the responses were any higher than if it was immunotherapy alone. But they proved a safe dose in combination and that trial which is federally funded, will continue to try to see if it was more than the immunotherapy alone would cause.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:56:50 – 2:56:59

Uh, I'm just telling you, cuz pa- patients are just begging for it. They really are. They just you know, a lot of people just say I'm not gonna be treated at all. You know, Dr. Hazen.

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:56:59 – 2:57:20

Y- you started the Right to Try Act, and that's exactly why the Right to Try Act was designed for. Unfortunately, the Right to Try act is very difficult to allow terminal patients to have access to anything. Personally, a person that's dying should have access to anything they want. My only concern.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:57:18 – 2:57:34

By the way, the the the reason it's not as effective is because we had to water it down, so the big pharma wouldn't tank it. That's that's the truth. We had to we had to we had to back it way down, make it pretty exclusive, so so the primary benefit right tries the title. OK.

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:57:34 – 2:58:41

Yes, but the the paperwork to get that right to trial a proof for a patient is very difficult for a practitioner to do. Um, you know, the the other thing that I wanted to say with these patients is, you know, they have the right, but my concern with hearing about Ivermectin and Phenbendazole on social media, and not having the right research backing it up, is patients that have an early cancer tend to want to go the route of Ivermectin, Phenbendazole, and could have just had a surgery to resect that stage one cancer, but now they've delayed the cancer and it's stage four. So I think this is why we need to do good research and this is why we cannot stop, the publications again of research and we, I wanna encourage all these physicians that are out there using Ivermectin and and Mibendazole to publish publish your data, so that we the physicians that are doing clinical trials can criticize it, it doesn't have to be retracted, it could stay there. So someone else can come in and say, you know what, I proved that person wrong and it didn't work.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:58:41 – 2:59:38

I mean, do- don't you think doctors themselves, um Yeah, I'm not You you don't want snake oil salesmen out there, you don't want, uh, you know, corrupted science. But you don't want this happening either. And again, I I think people admit that PubPierre, the in the initial the way it was initially run was was probably the right thing to do. It was valid, but then something took it over. And it you know, the now the nickname is pub smear. Um, so that that again, we're we're trying we're trying to at least highlight that, to maybe stop that abuse. Uh, but there there's gotta be, I mean, from my standpoint it's like publish the papers and, you know, h have your own reputation be the thing that really guides you in terms of not publishing junk. And if you publish junk, I mean pretty soon you're, I mean, I mean like real junk, not not being tormented, tormented with a bunch of, you know, spelling mistakes and stuff.

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:59:39 – 2:59:46

The medical community is very critical of papers to begin with. And if a paper passes peer review, it needs to stay.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:59:46 – 2:59:49

But talk about peer review, cuz we've talked about this,

Sabine Hazan (Witness)2:59:49 – 2:59:49

Yes.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:59:49 – 2:59:54

I mean, that's not exactly peer, pure either, is it? Cuz you, cuz you don't have any control who those peers are,

Aseem Malhotra (Witness)2:59:53 – 2:59:53

Right.

Sen. Johnson (WI)2:59:54 – 3:00:02

and you'll get sometimes get peers that have a different patent or a different drug and they wanna destroy your research. So I mean it's part of our problem.

Sabine Hazan (Witness)3:00:02 – 3:00:31

They, there, there's a problem in that area as well, but I mean, for the majority of peer reviewers, I'll give you an example, the paper that was in gut pathogen, that was retracted, the landmark paper of finding COVID in the stools. The Journal is now asking me to peer review the pay, another paper, because I'm considered the expert in the microbiome space. I find it funny that they retracted a landmark paper on COVID and now are asking me to peer review a paper on long COVID.

Sen. Johnson (WI)3:00:30 – 3:00:31

But for this project

Aseem Malhotra (Witness)3:00:34 – 3:01:30

Yeah, I just wanna make one really important point here, is that, you know, when it comes to randomized control trials, when, you know, doctors are making decisions on non-transparent data, the peer reviewers of those trials don't have access to the raw data. So they're making decisions on data that isn't transparent. And that, so we have to go further upstream, uh upstream, uh, Senator Johnson. In my view, with everything that's happened over the last few decades, we see the excessive use of medications. We have estimates uh you know the third most common cause of death globally after heart disease and cancer according to one senior cochrane uh review is prescribed medications because of avoidable side effects i mean that is extraordinary and that can be corrected if in the future we say enough is enough drug companies can no they can develop drugs but they can no longer test their own products and we just rely rely on their results that has to change until that changes you know medical knowledge will still be under commercial control.

Sen. Johnson (WI)3:01:33 – 3:01:46

i'm i've kind of run out of questions we've we've covered an awful lot of ground here i guess what i'll do is i'll give everybody a chance if if there's something that you wanna get off your chest here something we haven't discussed you wanna discuss so let's do it but you know keep it reasonably short but we'll start with doctor doglish

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)3:01:47 – 3:03:26

uh i think we need to uh just reiterate the that great difficulty the censorship that we've experienced i mean right at the beginning my colleagues and i noted that the sequence of the virus clearly had uh positive uh inserts into it. And uh this meant that it come from the laboratory. There could there could be no other explanation. And we submitted it to all the journals and they all rejected it with exactly the same thing. We have no problem with the science, it is not in the public interest. How come an ancient science cell of biology and the lancet all used the same words? It was like they were and to be buried. My university told me we were not allowed to research this, the the origin of the virus. This was is a suppression of something that I was I thought we are probably going into uh Stalin's communism or something. We were no longer allowed to discuss the truth, to discuss science, even if it was flawed, to discuss with other people. It was completely verboten. I've never thought that I would ever come to see that, but it has not stopped. If it's not stopped, it still continues, we can't get papers published on things they do not want. They come back and with a peer review they nitpick absolutely to the point where, you know, what's the point? They clearly don't want good data being published. So we must not forget that here we have had people who have lost their jobs be being totally targeted. And and the big thing is why? Why? And I must say when you get into a dystopia like this, you have to say, cue bono. You know, who is benefiting?

Sen. Johnson (WI)3:03:25 – 3:03:28

By by way of An insight I can give you,

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)3:03:27 – 3:03:28

And I think

Sen. Johnson (WI)3:03:28 – 3:03:32

an insight I can give you from our investigations, what we've seen in in talking to folks,

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)3:03:32 – 3:03:32

Yeah.

Sen. Johnson (WI)3:03:32 – 3:03:55

is a very major goal causing this is you cannot create vaccine hesitancy. So anyth- anything that, you know, any truth, you know, any injection injury that might alarm the public that just could cause vaccine hesitancy, they'll they'll rely on that. Say no, I mean, OK, we maybe we maybe should have warned the public.

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)3:03:55 – 3:03:56

OK.

Sen. Johnson (WI)3:03:56 – 3:04:39

But had we warned the public, that would have created vaccine hesitancy. And again, because we saved three point two million lives, we certainly can't deny people that that injection, cuz, OK, that that's I mean, I think that is driving a lot of this. And of course, why don't you wanna create a vaccine hesitancy? Because you don't put billions of dollars in the big farmers' pockets because they have no liability. for these for these vaccines and it's just big money making centers so yeah they they and and and they got the money and then they buy the ads and they in you know and they invest in invest in medical journals uh medical associations you know medical colleges

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)3:04:35 – 3:04:36

my my

Sen. Johnson (WI)3:04:40 – 3:04:42

that's that's the that's the the grift that's going on here

Angus Dalgleish (Witness)3:04:43 – 3:04:49

my my one sentence answer to that is it is time to withdraw the nineteen eighty six vaccine identity act

Sen. Johnson (WI)3:04:49 – 3:04:54

but no i i i agree i agree doctor al-dhiri

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)3:04:55 – 3:04:58

um well i've got a few things i wanna get off my chest

Sen. Johnson (WI)3:04:59 – 3:05:00

ok keep it short

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)3:05:00 – 3:08:05

um yes um so in science we need to be able to think creatively and talk with each other and discuss things in a civilized manner um you know with mutual respect and not being dismissed as irrelevant or or or whatever um and that's that's a big problem these days um i i think some of the issues we're talking about also have to do with informed consent um a lot of things i don't believe we have informed consent for covid mra vaccines i do wanna clarify you know the comment was made that we've been doing mrna research for decades it should be clear to everyone the pseudoyuridine modified mrnas were used for the first time in the population in the covid pandemic never before first time ever um and so you know there needs to be more oversight of these things and more uh modern regulations of what's allowable as contaminants you know with the lipid uh, nanoparticles. Um, the comment was made about elsewhere about how fast these tumors grow after the COVID, uh, vaccines. And I will say that we've known for a number of years, one of my colleagues, Doctor Rozel Kurzrock, one of the premier clinical trialists in the world, um, noticed that people who get cancer immunotherapy, uh a small percentage of them, their tumors grow, it's called hyperprogression. I don't use the term turbo-cancer, but hyperprogression is understood. And uh there's also pseudoprogression, that happens when people get cancer immunotherapy. And you have to tell the difference between those two, because the pseudoprogression is a mass that looks like it's getting bigger, because the immune system is fighting it. Um, and so, you know, some of the things that have been reported of these tumors that seem to be popping up and growing really quickly, that may not all be tumor cells that are dividing. I mean, it's the immune cells that are going in there, you get these swellings, and in, in the end, most of us probably carry cancer cells in our body that are being eliminated by our immune system. And so, you know, we just need to understand more. We need to do science. We need to let scientists do science, ask questions. We need to support it. I am all for supportive biomedical research and, you know, if we wanna be America first, we need to do that. But the, um, environment is pretty toxic, as far as,

Sen. Johnson (WI)3:08:04 – 3:08:04

Uh-huh.

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)3:08:06 – 3:08:11

uh, how people are disparaged. I mean, you know, there's certain, you just can't ask the questions.

Sen. Johnson (WI)3:08:11 – 3:08:41

oh he i'm i'm glad he brought up informed consent you know one one of our events we had uh doctor uh show the the package insert for the injection it was great big piece of paper all was written in intentionally left blank so yeah that that is not uh informed consent um uh you know you talked about boosting immune system i think that's doctor sun shung's technique with and you know trying to boost t cell production and stuff again these are these are theories he's got approval for a certain type of uh bladder cancer can't get approval

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)3:08:49 – 3:09:18

You know, I, like many of my colleagues, believe the immune system is our last hope, if we're gonna cure cancer. Um, and by the way, you know, we discovered a drug. We did basic science. It was funded almost twenty years ago. The drug was approved for treating brain cancer. And it boosts our innate immune system. same type of natural killer cells that doctor soonshong is trying to uh use to help patients so

Sen. Johnson (WI)3:09:18 – 3:09:25

and and and most chemo most chemotherapy therapy knocks out t cells right i mean really harms your immune system correct

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)3:09:25 – 3:10:08

they do but there's also data you know when people have combined chemo with immunotherapy and i've asked this question you know ten years ago it doesn't make sense and then the answer comes back but the data shows it works better so you know we have to be open-minded about what's observed and the data speaks for itself. Yes of course the immune system is so important, it's known people who are immunosuppressed are at risk for cancer, people who have had organ transplants. You stop there or you you know you you take away their immunosuppressive agents and they their immune system comes back and and can uh eliminate uh the cancer.

Sen. Johnson (WI)3:10:09 – 3:10:10

OK. Dr. Moll Street.

Saskia Mostert (Witness)3:10:10 – 3:10:10

Mm-hmm.

Wafik El-Deiry (Witness)3:10:11 – 3:10:11

Yes.

Saskia Mostert (Witness)3:10:11 – 3:12:40

Well, what I would like to add is that from early uh two thousand twenty, I think there was a major shift in public health policies. In the past, we had a system where the public health was based on weighing costs and benefits, including short and long-term harms, and disease burden was assessed on estimates of life years lost or impaired. And what also was taken into low socioeconomic status was linked to lower uh life expectancy, especially in low and middle income countries, but also in high income countries. And therefore, at that point it was clear that uh we should not uh implement border closures, lockdowns, no restrictions on health, people. And then something changed apparently, and I think that has to do with the rapid growth of certain industries that brought unprecedented wealth to a few individuals who have greater assets than some medium-sized company. And the direction of part of this wealth to health through philanthropy, uh, particularly public-private partnerships, I think that is what changed, uh, the public health policies that we are facing now. And you have to realize that there are significant conflicts of interest stemming from massive cross-over between private wealth investments philanthropic initiatives and global health policy directives so if you want to change i think for the future uh something then it's important to address this influence of public private partnerships on international organizations such as health organization governments but also very important on the media uh who um hey they they sponsor grants to journalism and media outlets and of course on science with regard to their funding of the university's research. That's a major point. And another major point, uh, referring to my testimony, I think what also needs to be learned from the COVID pandemic is that we are, uh, in need of legislative and regulatory frameworks to address, uh, the psychological manipulation, the fear propaganda and the censorship that has been implemented to protect the public f- in the future. and uh also to assure that science is not adjusted to political ideologies or corporate interests.

Sen. Johnson (WI)3:12:40 – 3:12:42

OK. Thank you. Doctor Hazen.

Sabine Hazan (Witness)3:12:42 – 3:14:33

Uh well I think it would I think the first thing uh for me is to stop these be retractions because they stop the science, period. Uh I think we need to encourage scientists to ask questions, and we need to debate the narrative. A good scientist debates the narrative. a good scientist, is humble to know that they may be wrong. And that was me during the pandemic. Am I right? Am I wrong? I don't know, but I'm willing to look at it. And then I'm willing to speak about what I saw for others to prove me wrong. Um, you know, what we need to realize is chronic disease is increasing. Cancer is increasing. Neurological diseases are increasing. ALS is increasing. One boy out of twelve in California has autism. What is it gonna be in a hundred years from now? One in one kid born gonna be autistic? This is why I'm up, this is why I'm here, this is why I've done my research. I I think we need to stop the destruction of microbes. Our lab has discovered that less than five percent have good bacteria that help absorb sugar. And one out of four thousand sa- samples that we've analyzed have a bacteria that is able to break down calcium to get into the cells. what happens when those microbes disappear? What are we doing? We're creating an increase in disease and we're not stopping to see what we are doing to damage the disease. And when somebody comes out and says, look, we're doing this and it's, you know, counter a narrative, they're being stopped. When we should be encouraging, you know, the research and the science to see if that person is right, and analyzing in depth what are we doing. So, I think more humility in science more freedom of speech to the scientists, more protection to the scientists and um you know stopping the retractions.

Sen. Johnson (WI)3:14:34 – 3:14:35

Couldn't agree more. Doctor.

Aseem Malhotra (Witness)3:14:37 – 3:16:21

Um I just wanna reiterate what Doctor El-Diri said really around the issue of informed consent and I'll give you one example that a lot of people may may resonate with. So, and this is my area of expertise where I've done research specifically, between two hundred million and one billion people globally, a prescribed prescribed a drug called statins. These are cholesterol lowering drugs. Now, if you are a low risk of heart disease, which is most of these people prescribe statins, your benefit over a five year period looking at the totality of evidence is one percent. There is a one in a hundred chance if you take that drug religiously, it'll prevent you having a heart attack or stroke, but without prolonging your life. If you are older, if you are older than seventy five, and I use the example, and if you'd uh allow me to do so, on publicly available data, We know that President Trump is in excellent health. But what I find a bit confusing is the fact that we look at people, somebody like President Trump is over seventy five without any evidence of significant vascular disease, no evidence of significant heart disease or stroke, et cetera. The benefit for someone like President Trump taking a statin is one in four hundred and forty six. So we have to treat four hundred and forty six people over seventy five to prevent one heart attack. He's also taking aspirin. And I was looking at this res- recently res- uh, re- um, uh, released data on President Trump, what he's taking. And again, if you don't have any significant vascular disease, your risk of a fatal bleed is significantly higher than preventing a heart attack. The point I'm making here, and I'm hoping President Trump is aware of this, but I suspect he isn't, is no one is immune to medical misinformation, not even the president. So the system is actually more powerful than any individual, and that's what we're dealing with. So collectively we have to sort this out together.

Sen. Johnson (WI)3:16:24 – 3:16:26

Doctor uh Grelow.

Julie Gralow (Witness)3:16:28 – 3:18:07

I think every single one of us on this panel wants what's best for our patients. And I think our fifty thousand members of our professional society, of physicians who treat um cancer patients, want what's best for our patients. I think we also agree that we need to understand the risks and the benefits of any vaccine, of any drug, of any treatment, and that the risks and benefits can be different depending on the person as well. They can be individualized. We believe in shared decision-making, which means a discussion between the patient and the clinician, um, understanding the patient's goals and wishes and desires. And true informed consent is difficult when you don't have the numbers you cannot use hypothetical or or kind of unproven without numbers kinds of information about either the benefits or the risks. Wearing my cancer hat, I would have to say that the evidence at this point in time shows overall that COVID vaccines have more benefits, um, and they outweigh the risks in our cancer population. I never got to speak on this piece of the the hearing, but I fully believe that we should have respectful and open scientific discussion. We should be able to disagree, but then back up and do the research or the studies to prove it. It should not be done on social media, and it should not be done in an anonymized way, as has been done.

Sen. Johnson (WI)3:18:08 – 3:18:13

Thank you, uh, Doctor Gralo. Uh, Miss Felder, you are in the anchor position there.

Tamika Felder (Witness)3:18:14 – 3:19:04

Thank you all. Um, again, I just wanna say the patient voice is really important, and I'm really happy to be here uh to represent cancer patients. Um, June fourteenth is the twenty-fifth anniversary of my surgery that I had just up the road at Johns Hopkins. I'm very thankful to the medical team there. I'm thankful to my oncologist. And even though treatment is tough, it's hard on the body and it does damage cells, I'm very thankful for that advancement because I wouldn't be here without that treatment. I want science to continue to advance so that we have more options for patients, and I'd like for the federal government to help those scientists and back that science and also the research. Thank you.

Sen. Johnson (WI)3:19:04 – 3:20:44

I appreciate that. And again, I've i- it is, it's about the patients, in the end it's about the patients. And a- as a potential one myself, I I i don't know what to believe that that's part of the problem so who do you believe who do you turn to and so as i've said repeatedly i think the the number one job of rfk junior is to restore integrity to science that's really the the main purpose of this hearing is to just show there's been corruption uh it's not good and i i agree with you completely doctor you yeah i was hoping this could be you know as as collaborative between you know the you know you experts here as possible and I just find a lot more areas of agreement than disagreement here, and that's that's encouraging and that's that's we need to keep seeking for. But you know, don't don't just dismiss, don't try and destroy people's lives when they disagree. Uh, if if there's a one one word definition of science, I think it's skepticism. It's what's driven science throughout history. You you you need the skeptic. You need somebody looking like, OK, I I know you I know you guys are pretty concerned about that, but not looking good to me. Uh, I'm I'm seeing something else. And then give that person a shot without just going destroy them. That's we we've seen way too many people destroyed during during covid. So again, I I truly appreciate this. I know, know it's not easier, easy. Uh, it's not cheap to come here. It's a lot of work to, uh, do these, uh, prepare these testimony's and stuff. And and, uh, I I I truly appreciate it. I think it's been an excellent hearing. Uh, the record will remain the record for this hearing will remain open for fifteen days until Thursday, June eighteenth, twenty twenty six at five p m. for the submission of statements and questions for the record this hearing is adjourned

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